• 2011movements-fsm discussion

  • Re: Methodology: Proposal for these days until next meeting

    from Kaylynn Strain on Dec 19, 2012 04:26 PM
    If there is a need for Spanish translation please send me the text to be
    translated and I'll do it
     On Dec 19, 2012 3:16 AM, "Luke Shore" <lukeshore@...> wrote:
    
    > Do you still need a French translation? If so I'll see if I've got time to
    > do one today.
    > Luke
    >
    >   ------------------------------
    > *From:* Daniel Seco <dsf_cm@...>
    > *To:* 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...
    > *Sent:* Tuesday, December 18, 2012 11:22 PM
    > *Subject:* [2011movements-fsm discussion] Methodology: Proposal for these
    > days until next meeting
    >
    >  (I wrote this in ENGLISH, can someone translate into french?)
    >
    >
    > Hello everybody,
    >
    >
    > USING THE LIST
    > Some of us have thought that, for the time being, we may use this list to
    > communicate about the actions to organize around the WSF.
    > To write an email to this list, just send a normal email to:
    > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...
    > You can add regular attachments to emails, but you should be aware that
    > there is over a 100 people on the list so we invite everyone to participate
    > but selfmoderate on the use of the list.
    > If you don't wish to continue in the list, you can unsubscribe, by sending
    > an email with subject "unsubscribe" to
    > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@..., and then following
    > the instructions that you will receive in your email.
    >
    >
    > MEETINGS
    > The meeting of today has just finished. Here are the minutes, please check
    > any possible errors:
    > http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSF3
    > We didn't have time to deal with points 4-9, so I proposed to work on
    > these topics on this list (see below).
    > Also, this is the continuation of a series of meetings in Mumble. You can
    > read the minutes of those meetings at:
    > http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSF
    > http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSF2
    > If you dont know what is Mumble or how to use Mumble ask us about it and
    > we'll be happy to help.
    > The next meeting will be held in Mumble on the 3rd of January of 2013.
    > Details about this meeting will be sent shortly.
    >
    > WORK UNTIL NEXT MEETING
    >
    > My proposal is to use this list to deal with all topics (dealt or not
    > with), during these 2 weeks until the 3rd of Jan. And to use the title's
    > first word to make clear which big topic do we want to adress in a given
    > email.
    >
    > Let us think for the time being that we are forming groups to work on each
    > topic but all of us are using the same list to communicate, just for a
    > start, and anyone is in whatever groups she wants. When we have a bit
    > clearer the process we will try to define this better.
    > Write in the subject which one of the topics you refer to and so we can
    > avoid undesired email. It does not matter if we dont keep a constant list
    > of topics, but it is important that we limit the number of emails each one
    > needs to read by a correct labelling.The list of topics could start with:
    >
    > - "*Current situation*" (what's happening in the WSF organization? what
    > are our assemblies thinking about the context?)
    > - "*Web*" (blog, web, communication tools, distribution list issues)
    > - "*Name*" (we are working on a name that defines well the group, please
    > read the minutes to observe the discussion)
    > - "*Statement*" (should we write a message to transmit to the
    > participants of the Forum? manifesto? communication material of any other
    > kind? how to define the objectives of our group?)
    > - "*Activities*" (assemblies in the streets, caravans, other activities)
    > - "*Extension*" (how to make people participate in activities from afar,
    > or organize their own activities at the same time to be included in our
    > process? streaming, bambuser,...)
    > - "*Translation*" (how to deal with language issues before during and
    > after the forum? who can help us with the ongoing translation arab-english,
    > and others?)
    > - "*Involvement of other groups*" (how to make others join? communication
    > and difussion strategy and materials, contact with local Tunisian groups)
    > - "*Finance and Infrastructures*" (do we want to crowdfund something
    > together? do we need any finance? what for? how to manage it? what
    > infrastructures do we need to guarantee the process? how can we obtain
    > sound systems? shall we camp? where? is there water? electricity? will it
    > cost money?)
    > - "*Methodology*" (are we breaking the horizontality or transparency or
    > openness of the process? are we missing its point? any other methodological
    > error?)
    > - "*Other topics within the WSF*"
    > - "*Off topic*" (non related anouncements or other comments)
    >
    > We could start by anouncing in which groups do we want to work or
    > something like that? Or with a proposal? Or reflexion?
    >
    > It is great working with you people, see you soon!
    > Daniel Seco
    >
    >
    >
    > --
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    >
    >
    >
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    Thread Outline:
  • Methodology: Languages proposal

    from daniseco on Dec 19, 2012 05:29 PM
    It seems like the critical languages are french and english. If anyone does not speak any of those we will find a way. Otherwise my recommendation is that we post in either language, and once in a while (perhaps every three days?) we do a summary in both languages. Maybe volunteering to translate?
     
    Does anyone understand neither english nor french?
    Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais et pas français?
    Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni frances?
    Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein Französisch versteht?
     
    Don't know what else can we do.
    This is my first ocassion on a list with such a diverse background list.
    
    
    • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

      from Umang Kumar on Dec 19, 2012 05:37 PM
      Yesterday's call was pretty well managed with English and French. We should
      keep it simple to begin with, keep that formula in the main and provide
      specific translations as needed (so request for volunteer translators).
      
      Umang
      
      On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 12:27 PM, Daniel Seco <dsf_cm@...> wrote:
      
      > It seems like the critical languages are french and english. If anyone
      > does not speak any of those we will find a way. Otherwise my recommendation
      > is that we post in either language, and once in a while (perhaps every
      > three days?) we do a summary in both languages. Maybe volunteering to
      > translate?
      >
      > Does anyone understand neither english nor french?
      > Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais et pas français?
      > Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni frances?
      > Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein Französisch versteht?
      >
      > Don't know what else can we do.
      > This is my first ocassion on a list with such a diverse background list.
      >
      >
      > --
      > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355938196138<http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355938196138>
      > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to
      > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact
      > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
      >
      
      
      
      -- 
      "The woods are lovely, dark and deep"
      
      
      
      • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

        from judith on Dec 19, 2012 05:43 PM
        That sounds pretty sensible, Umang! Great work
        
        Judith
        ---- Envoyé avec BlackBerry® d'Orange ----
        
        -----Original Message-----
        From: Umang Kumar <umkumar@...>
        Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2012 12:34:45 
        To: <2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...>
        Reply-To: 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...
        Subject: Re: [2011movements-fsm discussion] Methodology: Languages proposal
        
        Yesterday's call was pretty well managed with English and French. We should
        keep it simple to begin with, keep that formula in the main and provide
        specific translations as needed (so request for volunteer translators).
        
        Umang
        
        On Wed, Dec 19, 2012 at 12:27 PM, Daniel Seco <dsf_cm@...> wrote:
        
        > It seems like the critical languages are french and english. If anyone
        > does not speak any of those we will find a way. Otherwise my recommendation
        > is that we post in either language, and once in a while (perhaps every
        > three days?) we do a summary in both languages. Maybe volunteering to
        > translate?
        >
        > Does anyone understand neither english nor french?
        > Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais et pas français?
        > Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni frances?
        > Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein Französisch versteht?
        >
        > Don't know what else can we do.
        > This is my first ocassion on a list with such a diverse background list.
        >
        >
        > --
        > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355938196138<http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355938196138>
        > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to
        > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact
        > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
        >
        
        
        
        -- 
        "The woods are lovely, dark and deep"
        
        
        --
        Archive: http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355938638251
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    • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

      from judith on Dec 19, 2012 05:38 PM
      If you need the occasional helping hand, including Arabic, I am copying in Ounsi, who is coordinating pre-WSF translations for Babels.
      
      But if you can self-facilitate like you have been, I think that's really great!
      
      Si vous avez besoin d'un coup de main ponctuel, y compris en Arabe, je mets Ounsi en copie. Il coordonne les traductions pre-FSM pour Babels. 
      
      Mais si vous arrivez a vous debrouiller en traduisant par vous meme, je trouve cela genial!
      
      Amities solidaires
      
      Judith
      ---- Envoyé avec BlackBerry® d'Orange ----
      
      -----Original Message-----
      From: Daniel Seco <dsf_cm@...>
      Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2012 17:27:42 
      To: <2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...>
      Reply-To: 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...
      Subject: [2011movements-fsm discussion] Methodology: Languages proposal
      
      It seems like the critical languages are french and english. If anyone does not speak any of those we will find a way. Otherwise my recommendation is that we post in either language, and once in a while (perhaps every three days?) we do a summary in both languages. Maybe volunteering to translate?
       
      Does anyone understand neither english nor french?
      Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais et pas français?
      Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni frances?
      Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein Französisch versteht?
       
      Don't know what else can we do.
      This is my first ocassion on a list with such a diverse background list.
      
      --
      Archive: http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355938196138
      To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@....  Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
      
      
      
    • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

      from Olya Azatyan on Dec 19, 2012 07:10 PM
      English !
      
      
      On 19 December 2012 21:27, Daniel Seco <dsf_cm@...> wrote:
      
      > It seems like the critical languages are french and english. If anyone
      > does not speak any of those we will find a way. Otherwise my recommendation
      > is that we post in either language, and once in a while (perhaps every
      > three days?) we do a summary in both languages. Maybe volunteering to
      > translate?
      >
      > Does anyone understand neither english nor french?
      > Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais et pas français?
      > Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni frances?
      > Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein Französisch versteht?
      >
      > Don't know what else can we do.
      > This is my first ocassion on a list with such a diverse background list.
      >
      >
      > --
      > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355938196138<http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355938196138>
      > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to
      > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact
      > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
      >
      
      
      
      • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

        from vica on Dec 19, 2012 07:24 PM
        I also don't think we should make a problem about it until it becomes one, but I do think that Fausto's proposal could be useful in the future.
        I have created a google spreadsheet based on his proposal that people are welcome to fill in.
        
        https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuLcvUI3I5zydFFaTlZEYWNnYTVaVkNGWWRJN3ltY3c
        
        Note:
        U= can understand the written and spoken language
        S= con speak and write the language
        
        Please feel free to add other languages too.
        
        In general I find the best thing is that people communicate in the language they feel more comfortable and then we translate accordingly. But not sure how feasible this is…maybe we just need to try to see if it works. 
        I have lived many years in countries where I didn't speak the language, and found that google translate was a faithful companion for basic understanding of things: http://translate.google.com
        
        A weekly summary of the content of the emails that then can be translated also sounds like a good idea. 
        It then becomes a digest for those that cannot keep up with the flow, and a nice way of documenting our progress.
        BUT…it means also more work ;) …and not sure if anyone has enough time on their hands for this.
        
        Vica
        
        
        
        
        
        
        
        • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

          from Fausto Giudice on Dec 19, 2012 09:04 PM
          Vica
                Google translator is useless for languages like Arabic, it gives
                more or less understandable results only for the main imperial
                languages
                Its difficult to use  googledocs bicoz many people will not be
                able to access the page. It's better to create a pad
                
                Le 19/12/2012 20:22, Ludovica Rogers a écrit :
              
              
                I also don't think we should make a problem about it until it becomes one, but I do think that Fausto's proposal could be useful in the future.
          I have created a google spreadsheet based on his proposal that people are welcome to fill in.
          
          https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuLcvUI3I5zydFFaTlZEYWNnYTVaVkNGWWRJN3ltY3c
          
          Note:
          U= can understand the written and spoken language
          S= con speak and write the language
          
          Please feel free to add other languages too.
          
          In general I find the best thing is that people communicate in the language they feel more comfortable and then we translate accordingly. But not sure how feasible this is…maybe we just need to try to see if it works. 
          I have lived many years in countries where I didn't speak the language, and found that google translate was a faithful companion for basic understanding of things: http://translate.google.com
          
          A weekly summary of the content of the emails that then can be translated also sounds like a good idea. 
          It then becomes a digest for those that cannot keep up with the flow, and a nice way of documenting our progress.
          BUT…it means also more work ;) …and not sure if anyone has enough time on their hands for this.
          
          Vica
          
          
          
          
          
          
          
          --
          Archive: http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355945059506
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          • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

            from judith on Dec 19, 2012 09:54 PM
            And even in the imperial languages, if a sentence or an idea is anyway complex forget it: googletranslate or any of the other electronic tools can not do more than a very approximate and often totally inappropriate translation. I use it on occasion to get the gist of what my Korean or Japanese friends are saying, but it does require a lot of imagination to make sense of the translations!
            
            Judith 
            ---- Envoyé avec BlackBerry® d'Orange ----
            
            -----Original Message-----
            From: Fausto Giudice <faustogiu@...>
            Date: Wed, 19 Dec 2012 22:02:18 
            To: <2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...>
            Reply-To: 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...
            Subject: Re: [2011movements-fsm discussion] Methodology: Languages proposal
            
            
            Vica
             Google translator is useless for languages like Arabic, it gives more or less understandable results only for the main imperial languages
             Its difficult to use  googledocs bicoz many people will not be able to access the page. It's better to create a pad
             
             Le 19/12/2012 20:22, Ludovica Rogers a écrit :
             I also don't think we should make a problem about it until it becomes one, but I do think that Fausto's proposal could be useful in the future. I have created a google spreadsheet based on his proposal that people are welcome to fill in. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuLcvUI3I5zydFFaTlZEYWNnYTVaVkNGWWRJN3ltY3c Note: U= can understand the written and spoken language S= con speak and write the language Please feel free to add other languages too. In general I find the best thing is that people communicate in the language they feel more comfortable and then we translate accordingly. But not sure how feasible this is…maybe we just need to try to see if it works. I have lived many years in countries where I didn't speak the language, and found that google translate was a faithful companion for basic understanding of things: http://translate.google.com A weekly summary of the content of the emails that then can be translated also sounds like a good idea. It then becomes a digest for those that cannot keep up with the flow, and a nice way of documenting our progress. BUT…it means also more work ;) …and not sure if anyone has enough time on their hands for this. Vica -- Archive: http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355945059506 To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@... <mailto:2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...> . Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... <mailto:2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@...>  for questions. 
             
            
            
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            To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion&#0064;lists.openfsm.net <&#0109;ailto&#0058;2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion&#0064;lists.openfsm.net> . Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager&#0064;lists.openfsm.net <&#0109;ailto&#0058;2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager&#0064;lists.openfsm.net>  for questions.
             
            
        • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

          from daniseco on Dec 19, 2012 09:07 PM
          I can do a summary of what we speak on the list, weekly, until the next meeting at least.
          About the document you add on Google, I can't edit it, but my contribution would be "Dani, Spain, X, X, X, 0, X, X, X,0,0,0,X,0
           
          But can we please start talking about something else than the language??
          
          
          --- El mié, 19/12/12, Ludovica Rogers <vicaolsx@...> escribió:
          
          
          De: Ludovica Rogers <vicaolsx@...>
          Asunto: Re: [2011movements-fsm discussion] Methodology: Languages proposal
          Para: 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...
          Fecha: miércoles, 19 de diciembre, 2012 20:22
          
          
          I also don't think we should make a problem about it until it becomes one, but I do think that Fausto's proposal could be useful in the future.
          I have created a google spreadsheet based on his proposal that people are welcome to fill in.
          
          https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuLcvUI3I5zydFFaTlZEYWNnYTVaVkNGWWRJN3ltY3c
          
          Note:
          U= can understand the written and spoken language
          S= con speak and write the language
          
          Please feel free to add other languages too.
          
          In general I find the best thing is that people communicate in the language they feel more comfortable and then we translate accordingly. But not sure how feasible this is…maybe we just need to try to see if it works. 
          I have lived many years in countries where I didn't speak the language, and found that google translate was a faithful companion for basic understanding of things: http://translate.google.com
          
          A weekly summary of the content of the emails that then can be translated also sounds like a good idea. 
          It then becomes a digest for those that cannot keep up with the flow, and a nice way of documenting our progress.
          BUT…it means also more work ;) …and not sure if anyone has enough time on their hands for this.
          
          Vica
          
          
          
          
          
          
          
          --
          Archive: http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355945059506
          To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@....  Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
          
          
          
          • Methodology: Pads and communication on each topic

            from daniseco on Dec 19, 2012 09:23 PM
            As read that there were people in favour of doing this with the language of recording our language abilities, and some people defended to do it on pads:
            here is the pad for that, feel free to translate it.
            http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFlanguage
             
            We can also use this one for the instructions and methodology, so that when someone needs to learn how to use the list we can send her there:
            http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFmethod
            (i will fill it in now)
             
            And then perhaps as we go having more info to record for later, we can create thematic pads, and when they are too many, we will create a pad of pads, as this ends up being the case. Actually, I just created it:
            http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFpads 
             
            About how to collaborate with each group, the proposal was, in order to not spend too much time talking about methodology, to start using this list simply using the first word of the title to express which group is that directed to, so that people that are interested on that topic know that they should read it.
             
            Perhaps on those pads we could compile everything that is important and volunteers could go translating those pads once in a while to direct there people lost in translation?
             
            
            
            • Méthodologie: version française pour les non-anglophones

              from Fausto Giudice on Dec 19, 2012 11:12 PM
              La version française des instructions
                    sur la manière dutiliser la mailing list se trouve ici :
                    http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFmethod
                    Les traductions des autres docs suivront
                    
                    
                    Le 19/12/2012 22:21, Daniel Seco a écrit :
                  
                  
                    
                      
                        
                          
                            As read that there were people in favour of doing
                              this with the language of recording our language
                              abilities, and some people defended to do it on pads:
                            here is the pad for that, feel free to translate it.
                            http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFlanguage
                             
                            We can also use this one for the instructions and
                              methodology, so that when someone needs to learn how to
                              use the list we can send her there:
                            http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFmethod
                              (i will fill it in now)
                             
                            And then perhaps as we go having more info to record
                              for later, we can create thematic pads, and when they
                              are too many, we will create a pad of pads, as this ends
                              up being the case. Actually, I just created it:
                            http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFpads
                            
                             
                            About how to collaborate with each group, the
                              proposal was, in order to not spend too much time
                              talking about methodology, to start using this list
                              simply using the first word of the title to express
                              which group is that directed to, so that people that are
                              interested on that topic know that they should read it.
                             
                            Perhaps on those pads we could compile everything
                              that is important and volunteers could go translating
                              those pads once in a while to direct there people lost
                              in translation?
                             
                          
                        
                      
                    
                    
                      
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                      for questions.
              
            • Re: Methodology: Pads and communication on each topic

              from Kaylynn Strain on Dec 19, 2012 09:38 PM
              due to the limitations of my tablet I can not add to any pads, just chat
              On Dec 19, 2012 3:21 PM, "Daniel Seco" <dsf_cm@...> wrote:
              
              > As read that there were people in favour of doing this with the language
              > of recording our language abilities, and some people defended to do it on
              > pads:
              > here is the pad for that, feel free to translate it.
              > http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFlanguage
              >
              > We can also use this one for the instructions and methodology, so that
              > when someone needs to learn how to use the list we can send her there:
              > http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFmethod
              > (i will fill it in now)
              >
              > And then perhaps as we go having more info to record for later, we can
              > create thematic pads, and when they are too many, we will create a pad of
              > pads, as this ends up being the case. Actually, I just created it:
              > http://titanpad.com/agora99firezneWSFpads
              >
              > About how to collaborate with each group, the proposal was, in order to
              > not spend too much time talking about methodology, to start using this list
              > simply using the first word of the title to express which group is that
              > directed to, so that people that are interested on that topic know that
              > they should read it.
              >
              > Perhaps on those pads we could compile everything that is important and
              > volunteers could go translating those pads once in a while to direct there
              > people lost in translation?
              >
              >
              >
              > --
              > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355952227397<http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355952227397>
              > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to
              > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact
              > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
              >
              
              
              
          • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

            from vica on Dec 19, 2012 09:22 PM
            Sorry editing has been enabled now.
            
            On Dec 19, 2012, at 9:05 PM, Daniel Seco <dsf_cm@...> wrote:
            
            > 
            > I can do a summary of what we speak on the list, weekly, until the next meeting at least.
            > About the document you add on Google, I can't edit it, but my contribution would be "Dani, Spain, X, X, X, 0, X, X, X,0,0,0,X,0
            >  
            > But can we please start talking about something else than the language??
            > 
            > 
            > --- El mié, 19/12/12, Ludovica Rogers <vicaolsx@...> escribió:
            > 
            > De: Ludovica Rogers <vicaolsx@...>
            > Asunto: Re: [2011movements-fsm discussion] Methodology: Languages proposal
            > Para: 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...
            > Fecha: miércoles, 19 de diciembre, 2012 20:22
            > 
            > I also don't think we should make a problem about it until it becomes one, but I do think that Fausto's proposal could be useful in the future.
            > I have created a google spreadsheet based on his proposal that people are welcome to fill in.
            > 
            > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuLcvUI3I5zydFFaTlZEYWNnYTVaVkNGWWRJN3ltY3c
            > 
            > Note:
            > U= can understand the written and spoken language
            > S= con speak and write the language
            > 
            > Please feel free to add other languages too.
            > 
            > In general I find the best thing is that people communicate in the language they feel more comfortable and then we translate accordingly. But not sure how feasible this is…maybe we just need to try to see if it works. 
            > I have lived many years in countries where I didn't speak the language, and found that google translate was a faithful companion for basic understanding of things: http://translate.google.com
            > 
            > A weekly summary of the content of the emails that then can be translated also sounds like a good idea. 
            > It then becomes a digest for those that cannot keep up with the flow, and a nice way of documenting our progress.
            > BUT…it means also more work ;) …and not sure if anyone has enough time on their hands for this.
            > 
            > Vica
            > 
            > 
            > 
            > 
            > 
            > 
            > 
            > --
            > Archive: http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355945059506
            > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@....  Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
            > 
            > 
            > --
            > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355951253400
            > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
            
            
            
            
    • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

      from mariangela on Dec 20, 2012 09:55 AM
      I think if we can have spanish too 
      will be great and we could use this message also to send to all the lists (transcolab, squares,....)
      in order to tell people interested in the process that we are using this list
      mariangela 
      
      
      
      
      
      
      
      
      El 19/12/2012, a las 18:27, Daniel Seco escribió:
      
      > It seems like the critical languages are french and english. If anyone does not speak any of those we will find a way. Otherwise my recommendation is that we post in either language, and once in a while (perhaps every three days?) we do a summary in both languages. Maybe volunteering to translate?
      >  
      > Does anyone understand neither english nor french?
      > Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais et pas français?
      > Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni frances?
      > Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein Französisch versteht?
      >  
      > Don't know what else can we do.
      > This is my first ocassion on a list with such a diverse background list.
      > 
      > 
      > --
      > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355938196138
      > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
      
      
      
      
    • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

      from Fausto Giudice on Dec 19, 2012 06:34 PM
      Daniel
      Sobre la base de mi experiencia de 7 años de animación de una red de 
      traductores, creo que la única manera es de hacer un pad con una tabla 
      de este tipo:
      
      Nom Name Nombre
      
      ???
      
      isim
      
      	
      
      EN
      
      	
      
      FR
      
      	
      
      ES
      
      	
      
      DE
      
      	
      
      TR
      
      	
      
      IT
      
      	
      
      PT
      
      	
      
      AR
      
      	
      
      OTH 1
      
      	
      
      OTH2
      
      Fausto Tunis
      
      	
      
      X
      
      	
      
      X
      
      	
      
      X
      
      	
      
      X
      
      	
      
      O
      
      	
      
      X
      
      	
      
      0
      
      	
      
      0
      
      	
      
        SV
      
      	
      
      Daniel Barcelona
      
      	
      
      x
      
      	
      
      x
      
      	
      
      x
      
      	
      
        x
      
      	
      
      	
      
      	
      
      	
      
      	
      
      CAT
      
      	
      
      
      y pedir a la gente que se inscriban, poniendo X para los idiomas que 
      saben y 0 para los que no saben
      Pues, cuando tendremos la tabla llenada, podremos decidir en cuales 
      idiomas podemos/tenemos que comunicar
      Si hay muy poca gente que no entiende inglés, se puede organizar un 
      sistema "privado" de traducción oral cada 3 días en Mumble, por ejemplo, 
      porque es mas rápido que escribir traducciones
      Fausto
      
      Le 19/12/2012 18:27, Daniel Seco a écrit :
      > It seems like the critical languages are french and english. If anyone 
      > does not speak any of those we will find a way. Otherwise my 
      > recommendation is that we post in either language, and once in a while 
      > (perhaps every three days?) we do a summary in both languages. Maybe 
      > volunteering to translate?
      > Does anyone understand neither english nor french?
      > Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais et pas français?
      > Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni frances?
      > Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein Französisch versteht?
      > Don't know what else can we do.
      > This is my first ocassion on a list with such a diverse background list.
      >
      >
      >
      > --
      > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[...]/1355938196138 
      > <http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355938196138>
      > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 
      > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@... 
      > <mailto:2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...>. Please 
      > contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... 
      > <mailto:2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@...> 
      > for questions.
      
      
      
      
      • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

        from daniseco on Dec 19, 2012 06:43 PM
        Do we have the means for this? And ... aren't we trying to create a problem where so far nobody is complaining? Somebody some time ago complained in French so I guess it is important to do it in French but let's go on as far as none complains, right?
        Also, I speak french enough to understand it but not to write it,...
        
        
        --- El mié, 19/12/12, Fausto Giudice <faustogiu@...> escribió:
        
        
        De: Fausto Giudice <faustogiu@...>
        Asunto: Re: [2011movements-fsm discussion] Methodology: Languages proposal
        Para: 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@..., "Daniel Seco" <dsf_cm@...>
        Fecha: miércoles, 19 de diciembre, 2012 19:32
        
        
        
        
        Daniel
        Sobre la base de mi experiencia de 7 años de animación de una red de traductores, creo que la única manera es de hacer un pad con una tabla de este tipo:
        
        
        
        
        
        
        Nom Name Nombre
        اسم
        isim
        
        EN
        
        FR
        
        ES 
        
        DE 
        
        TR
        
        IT
        
        PT 
        
        AR
        
        OTH 1
        
        OTH2
        
        
        Fausto Tunis
        
        X
        
        X
        
        X
        
        X
        
        O
        
        X
        
        0
        
        0 
        
         SV
        
         
        
        
        Daniel Barcelona
        
        x
        
        x
        
        x
        
         x
        
         
        
         
        
         
        
         
        
        CAT
        
         
         
        y pedir a la gente que se inscriban, poniendo X para los idiomas que saben y 0 para los que no saben
        Pues, cuando tendremos la tabla llenada, podremos decidir en cuales idiomas podemos/tenemos que comunicar
        Si hay muy poca gente que no entiende inglés, se puede organizar un sistema "privado" de traducción oral cada 3 días en Mumble, por ejemplo, porque es mas rápido que escribir traducciones
        Fausto
        
        
        
        
        Le 19/12/2012 18:27, Daniel Seco a écrit :
        
        
        
        
        
        
        It seems like the critical languages are french and english. If anyone does not speak any of those we will find a way. Otherwise my recommendation is that we post in either language, and once in a while (perhaps every three days?) we do a summary in both languages. Maybe volunteering to translate?
         
        Does anyone understand neither english nor french?
        Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais et pas français?
        Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni frances?
        Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein Französisch versteht?
         
        Don't know what else can we do.
        This is my first ocassion on a list with such a diverse background list.
        
        
        --
        Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355938196138
        To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
        
        
        
        
        --
        Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355942057859
        To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
        
        
        
        • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

          from Kaylynn Strain on Dec 19, 2012 06:52 PM
          if my offer to translatr between English and Spanish offended anyone I
          sincerrly apologoze
          On Dec 19, 2012 12:41 PM, "Daniel Seco" <dsf_cm@...> wrote:
          
          > Do we have the means for this? And ... aren't we trying to create a
          > problem where so far nobody is complaining? Somebody some time ago
          > complained in French so I guess it is important to do it in French but
          > let's go on as far as none complains, right?
          > Also, I speak french enough to understand it but not to write it,...
          >
          >
          > --- El *mié, 19/12/12, Fausto Giudice <faustogiu@...>* escribió:
          >
          >
          > De: Fausto Giudice <faustogiu@...>
          > Asunto: Re: [2011movements-fsm discussion] Methodology: Languages proposal
          > Para: 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@..., "Daniel Seco" <
          > dsf_cm@...>
          > Fecha: miércoles, 19 de diciembre, 2012 19:32
          >
          >  Daniel
          > Sobre la base de mi experiencia de 7 años de animación de una red de
          > traductores, creo que la única manera es de hacer un pad con una tabla de
          > este tipo:
          >
          >   Nom Name Nombre
          >
          > اسم
          >
          > isim
          >
          >  EN
          >
          > FR
          >
          > ES
          >
          > DE
          >
          > TR
          >
          > IT
          >
          > PT
          >
          > AR
          >
          > OTH 1
          >
          > OTH2
          >
          > Fausto Tunis
          >
          > X
          >
          > X
          >
          > X
          >
          > X
          >
          > O
          >
          > X
          >
          > 0
          >
          > 0
          >
          >  SV
          >
          >
          >
          > Daniel Barcelona
          >
          > x
          >
          > x
          >
          > x
          >
          >  x
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > CAT
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > y pedir a la gente que se inscriban, poniendo X para los idiomas que saben
          > y 0 para los que no saben
          > Pues, cuando tendremos la tabla llenada, podremos decidir en cuales
          > idiomas podemos/tenemos que comunicar
          > Si hay muy poca gente que no entiende inglés, se puede organizar un
          > sistema "privado" de traducción oral cada 3 días en Mumble, por ejemplo,
          > porque es mas rápido que escribir traducciones
          > Fausto
          > Le 19/12/2012 18:27, Daniel Seco a écrit :
          >
          >   It seems like the critical languages are french and english. If anyone
          > does not speak any of those we will find a way. Otherwise my recommendation
          > is that we post in either language, and once in a while (perhaps every
          > three days?) we do a summary in both languages. Maybe volunteering to
          > translate?
          >
          > Does anyone understand neither english nor french?
          > Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais et pas français?
          > Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni frances?
          > Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein Französisch versteht?
          >
          > Don't know what else can we do.
          > This is my first ocassion on a list with such a diverse background list.
          >
          >
          > --
          > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355938196138<http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355938196138>
          > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to
          > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...<http://es.mc1717.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...>.
          > Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@...<http://es.mc1717.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@...>for questions.
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --
          > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355942057859<http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355942057859>
          > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to
          > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact
          > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
          >
          >
          > --
          > Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355942599281<http://openfsm.net/projects/2011movements-fsm-wsf/lists/2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion/archive/2012/12/1355942599281>
          > To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to
          > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@.... Please contact
          > 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@... for questions.
          >
          
          
          
          • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

            from Fausto Giudice on Dec 19, 2012 07:02 PM
            Not at all, Kaylynn, I believe you
                  misunderstood something. Instructions over how to use the mailing
                  list will always be useful, in Spanish too
                  
                  Le 19/12/2012 19:50, Kaylynn Strain a écrit :
                
                
                  if my offer to translatr between English and Spanish offended
                    anyone I sincerrly apologoze
                  On Dec 19, 2012 12:41 PM, "Daniel Seco"
                    <dsf_cm@...>
                    wrote:
                    
                      
                        
                          
                            
                              Do we have the means for this? And ... aren't we
                                trying to create a problem where so far nobody is
                                complaining? Somebody some time ago complained in
                                French so I guess it is important to do it in French
                                but let's go on as far as none complains, right?
                              Also, I speak french enough to understand it but
                                not to write it,...
                              
                                
                                --- El mié, 19/12/12, Fausto Giudice <faustogiu@...>
                                escribió:
                              
                              
                                De: Fausto Giudice <faustogiu@...>
                                Asunto: Re: [2011movements-fsm discussion]
                                Methodology: Languages proposal
                                Para: 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...,
                                "Daniel Seco" <dsf_cm@...>
                                Fecha: miércoles, 19 de diciembre, 2012 19:32
                                
                                
                                  
                                    Daniel
                                      Sobre la base de mi experiencia de 7 años de
                                      animación de una red de traductores, creo que
                                      la única manera es de hacer un pad con una
                                      tabla de este tipo:
                                      
                                      
                                        
                                          
                                            
                                              Nom Name
                                                  Nombre
                                            
                                          
                                        
                                      
                                    
                                    اسم
                                  
                                  isim
                                
                              
                            
                            
                              EN
                            
                            
                              FR
                            
                            
                              ES 
                            
                            
                              DE 
                            
                            
                              TR
                            
                            
                              IT
                            
                            
                              PT 
                            
                            
                              AR
                            
                            
                              OTH 1
                            
                            
                              OTH2
                            
                          
                          
                            
                              Fausto Tunis
                            
                            
                              X
                            
                            
                              X
                            
                            
                              X
                            
                            
                              X
                            
                            
                              O
                            
                            
                              X
                            
                            
                              0
                            
                            
                              0 
                            
                            
                               SV
                            
                            
                               
                            
                          
                          
                            
                              Daniel Barcelona
                            
                            
                              x
                            
                            
                              x
                            
                            
                              x
                            
                            
                               x
                            
                            
                               
                            
                            
                               
                            
                            
                               
                            
                            
                               
                            
                            
                              CAT
                            
                            
                               
                            
                          
                        
                      
                       
                        y pedir a la gente que se inscriban, poniendo X para los
                        idiomas que saben y 0 para los que no saben
                        Pues, cuando tendremos la tabla llenada, podremos decidir en
                        cuales idiomas podemos/tenemos que comunicar
                        Si hay muy poca gente que no entiende inglés, se puede
                        organizar un sistema "privado" de traducción oral cada 3
                        días en Mumble, por ejemplo, porque es mas rápido que
                        escribir traducciones
                        Fausto
                        Le 19/12/2012 18:27, Daniel Seco a écrit :
                      
                      
                        
                          
                            
                              
                                It seems like the critical languages are french
                                  and english. If anyone does not speak any of those
                                  we will find a way. Otherwise my recommendation is
                                  that we post in either language, and once in a
                                  while (perhaps every three days?) we do a summary
                                  in both languages. Maybe volunteering to
                                  translate?
                                 
                                Does anyone understand neither english nor
                                  french?
                                Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas anglais
                                  et pas français?
                                Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni
                                  frances?
                                Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und kein
                                  Französisch versteht?
                                 
                                Don't know what else can we do.
                                This is my first ocassion on a list with such
                                  a diverse background list.
                              
                            
                          
                        
                        
                          
                          --
                          Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355938196138
                          To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to
                          2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@....
                          Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@...
                          for questions.
                        
                      
                      
                      
                        
                        --
                        Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355942057859
                        To unsubscribe send an email with subject "unsubscribe" to 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@....
                        Please contact 2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion-manager@...
                        for questions.
                      
                      
                        
                        --
                        Archive: http://openfsm.net/[…]/1355942599281
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                        for questions.
                      
                    
                  
                  
                    
                    --
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                    for questions.
            
        • Re: Methodology: Languages proposal

          from Fausto Giudice on Dec 19, 2012 06:59 PM
          Daniel
                We must think forward and foresee to expand to much more "members"
                from anywhere than there are now
                Adding to that, this would be useful to do, to have a tool for
                future opportunities, like assemblies en Tunisia or elsewhere
                
                Le 19/12/2012 19:41, Daniel Seco a écrit :
              
              
                
                  
                    
                      
                        Do we have the means for this? And ... aren't we
                          trying to create a problem where so far nobody is
                          complaining? Somebody some time ago complained in French
                          so I guess it is important to do it in French but let's
                          go on as far as none complains, right?
                        Also, I speak french enough to understand it but not
                          to write it,...
                        
                          
                          --- El mié, 19/12/12, Fausto Giudice <faustogiu@...>
                          escribió:
                        
                        
                          De: Fausto Giudice <faustogiu@...>
                          Asunto: Re: [2011movements-fsm discussion] Methodology:
                          Languages proposal
                          Para:
                          2011movements-fsm-wsf-discussion@...,
                          "Daniel Seco" <dsf_cm@...>
                          Fecha: miércoles, 19 de diciembre, 2012 19:32
                          
                          
                            
                              Daniel
                                Sobre la base de mi experiencia de 7 años de
                                animación de una red de traductores, creo que la
                                única manera es de hacer un pad con una tabla de
                                este tipo:
                                
                                
                                  
                                    
                                      
                                        Nom Name Nombre
                                        
                                        اسم
                                        
                                        isim
                                      
                                      
                                        EN
                                      
                                      
                                        FR
                                      
                                      
                                        ES 
                                      
                                      
                                        DE 
                                      
                                      
                                        TR
                                      
                                      
                                        IT
                                      
                                      
                                        PT 
                                      
                                      
                                        AR
                                      
                                      
                                        OTH 1
                                      
                                      
                                        OTH2
                                      
                                    
                                    
                                      
                                        Fausto Tunis
                                      
                                      
                                        X
                                      
                                      
                                        X
                                      
                                      
                                        X
                                      
                                      
                                        X
                                      
                                      
                                        O
                                      
                                      
                                        X
                                      
                                      
                                        0
                                      
                                      
                                        0 
                                      
                                      
                                         SV
                                      
                                      
                                         
                                      
                                    
                                    
                                      
                                        Daniel
                                            Barcelona
                                      
                                      
                                        x
                                      
                                      
                                        x
                                      
                                      
                                        x
                                      
                                      
                                         x
                                      
                                      
                                         
                                      
                                      
                                         
                                      
                                      
                                         
                                      
                                      
                                         
                                      
                                      
                                        CAT
                                      
                                      
                                         
                                      
                                    
                                  
                                
                                 
                                  y pedir a la gente que se inscriban, poniendo X
                                  para los idiomas que saben y 0 para los que no
                                  saben
                                  Pues, cuando tendremos la tabla llenada,
                                  podremos decidir en cuales idiomas
                                  podemos/tenemos que comunicar
                                  Si hay muy poca gente que no entiende inglés, se
                                  puede organizar un sistema "privado" de
                                  traducción oral cada 3 días en Mumble, por
                                  ejemplo, porque es mas rápido que escribir
                                  traducciones
                                  Fausto
                                
                              
                              
          
          Le 19/12/2012 18:27, Daniel Seco a écrit :
                            
                            
                              
                                
                                  
                                    
                                      It seems like the critical languages
                                        are french and english. If anyone does not
                                        speak any of those we will find a way.
                                        Otherwise my recommendation is that we
                                        post in either language, and once in a
                                        while (perhaps every three days?) we do a
                                        summary in both languages. Maybe
                                        volunteering to translate?
                                       
                                      Does anyone understand neither english
                                        nor french?
                                      Il y a des personnes que comprenent pas
                                        anglais et pas français?
                                      Hay alguno que no entienda ni ingles ni
                                        frances?
                                      Gibt's jemanden die kein Englisch und
                                        kein Französisch versteht?
                                       
                                      Don't know what else can we do.
                                      This is my first ocassion on a list
                                        with such a diverse background list.
                                    
                                  
                                
                              
                              
                                
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