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minutes cs 18 nov 09
IN and outLink: #_Toc247089216
Information from DakarLink: #_Toc247089217
Nairobiactionable themes or wf objectivesLink: #_Toc247089218
Relationships from AfricaLink: #_Toc247089219
Dakar committeeLink: #_Toc247089220
Questions on methodologyLink: #_Toc247089221
Dakar event logisticsLink: #_Toc247089222
IC commission reports in Dakar seminarLink: #_Toc247089223
4 groups combination in the seminarLink: #_Toc247089224
Dakar Communication commission meetingLink: #_Toc247089225
items discussed in this comcomLink: #_Toc247089226
interest for Dakar expandedLink: #_Toc247089227
Webactivists – infrastructure and event websiteLink: #_Toc247089228
Culture groupLink: #_Toc247089229
Media involvementLink: #_Toc247089230
African comcom on openfsmLink: #_Toc247089231
Venue of DakarLink: #_Toc247089232
2010 visual identityLink: #_Toc247089233
comcom plan finalizationLink: #_Toc247089234
Next steps – activityLink: #_Toc247089235
Comcom chat Agenda on line ?Link: #_Toc247089236
Johannesburg news from Dan –info about African social forumsLink: #_Toc247089237
Jason and Pierre Feedback on Mallory draft message for tech meetingLink: #_Toc247089238
IN and out
Hola amigos, ya están reunidos?
[21:06:17] Pierre: :)
[21:09:50] Jason: Hola Norma!
[21:12:04] Jason: Yo estoy!Que tal?
Hay ningun otro/a aqui? [21:12:20] Pierre: (bow) (that is jason speaking)
maipoy: ciao Jason y Norma, disculpen pero yo no podre estar en la reunion hoy.. dear jason and norma, and pierre now, sorry, I won't be able to stay in the meeting. thanks jason for the info on updates. will go through and send comments by the 20th
[21:13:38] Jason: Bonsoir Pierre!Ciao Claudia. - no te preocupe! [21:15:33] Pierre: I just came back from Dakar, where the first meeting at the panafrican and international level took place in preparation of the WSF 2011.I think it has been a good meeting and we also had space for a working group con communication and culture for a few hours, raising many issues and trying to find how the 3 levels (local, regional and international) can work together. Igor should be sending shortly a report of the meeting - and others from the WSF2011 organising committee will join us in the next online meetings. [21:15:42] Pierre: [21:17:21] Jason: Ah... thanks Pierre.It looked familiar! [21:17:58] Pierre: any comment welcome.... not precluding report from igor to come
[21:21:03] Jason: Well - I'm wondering if anyone else is here. I read that judith and antonio are not able to join. [21:57:28] *** Jason a invité dan*** I can give you a brief update (in English - sorry Norma).[21:23:42] Pierre: please Jason go ahead we have also received from MIkkael Book athttp://www.nigd.org/ you may read my notes from the two first 2 days of the 3-day preparatory seminar in Dakar and see a photo. [21:24:49] Jason: Before the meeting starting on Monday (see agenda here: http://africansocialforum.org/francais/fsm/fsm2011/=002=.htm ), there was the African Council meeting which I did not attend but was briefly reported the first day.
[21:26:49] normafer: Vine a la oficina especialmente una hora para para el chat, pero o me equivoqué de horario o no hay chat hoy. Debo irme a una reunión, leeré después el reporte.
[21:28:28] Pierre: norma el chat comenzo hace 26 mn [21:28:39] Pierre: la ora definida quiero decir
[21:28:59] normafer: Sí, ahora los veo, por alguna razón me pusieron en otro
[21:56:42] normafer: Amigos, debo irem porque estoy llegando tardísimo a una reunión de trabajo. leeré este informe de jason con calma luego y seguiremos por mai.Un abrazo. [21:58:22] Jason: Ciao Norma, un abrazo! [21:58:33] dan : hi Jason [21:58:40] Jason: Hey Dan! [21:58:43] Jason: Welcome back! [21:58:52] Pierre: ciao norma , hello dan [21:59:33] dan : Hi! I'm between two other meetings so I may be slightly fragmented in my replies. [21:59:39] dan : Yes, a report would be useful. [21:59:58] dan : Hi Pierre! [22:00:38] Mallory : hello everyone [22:01:22] dan : Hi Mallory! [22:01:29] dan : Greetings from Sao Paulo! [22:01:39] Pierre: oi Mallory [23:05:38] Jason: [bye, go on - I will read tomorrow] [23:06:02] dan : take care Jason, thanks for the report [23:09:13] Mallory : bye! [23:09:27] dan : Bye Mallory! ... then i guess our chat is over [23:12:47] dan : Ok [23:12:56] dan : Good to cross paths [23:13:08] dan : take care and good night [23:13:27] Pierre: (wave) [21:12:20] Pierre: (bow)(that is jason speaking) I just came back from Dakar, where the first meeting at the panafrican and international level took place in preparation of the WSF 2011.I think it has been a good meeting and we also had space for a working group con communication and culture for a few hours, raising many issues and trying to find how the 3 levels (local, regional and international) can work together. Igor should be sending shortly a report of the meeting - and others from the WSF2011 organising committee will join us in the next online meetings. [21:17:21] Jason: Ah... thanks Pierre.It looked familiar! [21:17:58] Pierre: any comment welcome.... not precluding report from igor to come I can give you a brief update (in English - sorry Norma).
Information from Dakar
[21:31:21] Jason: Samir Amir opened the first session with the analysis of the context and a discussion followed.This part I must say wasn't particularly helpful in defining the context because the discussion kept being on the fact that there is a multidimensional crisis and that the movements are fractioned.
Abouba from the African council made a synthesis at the end: here are a few points:
1. There's is a need of making the convergence among movements stronger, reinforcing alliances and links between social movements and the struggles around the world;
Nairobiactionable themes or wf objectives
[21:33:48] Jason: 2. The 21 themes in Nairobi and the thematic assemblies in Belem are a first step, need to go further and make a catalogue of the issues around which the wsf participants work (Mikael Book's proposal)
[21:34:16] Pierre: ( not any more the 10 objectives ?)
[21:36:31] Jason: That was not specified - just the fact that the themes/objectives should not always be redifined - but try to find the core "semantics" of the forum.This could well tie in with the work we'd like to do on Memory and documentation (I did mention it) [21:23:42] Pierre: please Jason go aheadwe have also received from MIkkael Book athttp://www.nigd.org/ you may read my notes from the two first 2 days of the 3-day preparatory seminar in Dakar and see a photo.
3. Dakar as an occasion to bring new relationships between Africa and India, Africa and Latin America, Africa and USA, etc.
Dakar committee
[21:39:17] Jason: Special attention in the inclusion of: workers, youth, union workers, migrants, women (the WSF2011 committe is organised in a number of commissions:
1. Scientific (methodology)
2. Logistics
3. Mobilisation
4. Finance
5. Culture
6. Gender
7. Diaspora
8. Youth
9. Communication
10. Health / security
Questions on methodology
[21:41:16] Pierre: is there any detail about the diaspora agenda and the difference with mobilization?
[21:42:00] Pierre: also about methodology has there been a discussion on the task of welcoming al going back to earlier questions
in strategy/ methodology groupor in plenarydo you know whetherthere hasbeen a discussion on the tasks taks of welcoming all the proposals emerging from wsf 2010 process? and orientation about 2011 assembliesand the post Dakar monthes
[21:42:32] Pierre: and comments on 2011 assemblies ?
[21:42:56] Jason: They have worked on a plan of action and a memorandum of understanding between the local organisers (secretariat) and the panafrican council.Not clear if they will make a consortium like they had in Brasil.
They also made a first budget for the process towards WSF2011 (around 2,5 mil euros total) - but the fundraising has yet to start...They intend to have various activities and a big event mid year 2010.
IC commission reports in Dakar seminar
[21:45:06] Jason: The afternoon the agenda changed - so we had reports from the international council members on the planning support from various commissions (expansion, methodology, strategy, communication).
[21:45:35] Pierre: you mean it was not originally planned to have those reports?
[21:46:08] Jason: It was supposed to be the next day.
[21:46:39] Pierre: (was a two day o three day seminar ?- i see you are back today and mikkael book made a report only on 16 and 17 )
[21:47:28] Jason: 2 days + meetings with local groups and mayor of Dakar on the third day/today (but I left early in the morning)
[21:47:45] Jason: So quickly getting into communication matters...
[21:52:15] Jason: I spoke about the IC comcom working plan and how many of the activities could support the mobilisation effort for 2011 as well as coverage and other activities during the forum.The next day in the working group on communication and culture, we went into detailed discussion.Igor took the notes and reported back in the plenary.I'll just mention here what where the main issues
[21:53:29] Jason: (Igor Palakot works for ENDA, Taoufik's organisation - where the African's secretariat is based)
4 groups combination in the seminar
[21:54:17] Pierre: i see in michael book report that 4 groups met
1. Strategy, Content, Methodology,( shall meet again in porto alegre)
2. Mobilization,Expansion, 2010-2011
3. Communication, Culture
4. Logistics, Resources
(what are those group meant to bejust a ad hoc gathering on occasion of Dakar seminar? there seem to be mix between IC commission and Dakar OC groups)
Dakar Communication commission meeting
[21:56:42] normafer: Amigos, debo irem porque estoy llegando tardísimo a una reunión de trabajo. leeré este informe de jason con calma luego y seguiremos por mai.Un abrazo. [21:57:28] *** Jason a invité dan*** [21:58:22] Jason: Ciao Norma, un abrazo! [21:58:33] dan : hi Jason [21:58:40] Jason: Hey Dan! [21:58:43] Jason: Welcome back! [21:58:52] Pierre: ciao norma , hello dan [21:59:16] Jason: I'm trying to make a brief summary of what was discussed in Dakar in the last 2 days. [21:59:33] dan : Hi! I'm between two other meetings so I may be slightly fragmented in my replies. [21:59:39] dan : Yes, a report would be useful. [21:59:58] dan : Hi Pierre! [22:00:38] Mallory : hello everyone [22:01:22] dan : Hi Mallory! [22:01:29] dan : Greetings from Sao Paulo! [22:01:39] Pierre: oi Mallory [22:03:37] Jason: The African organising committe communication commission is made up as of now of 21 persons, most from Senegal but it is widening.A few of them were present, including the facilitator who is Tidjan Cessé (not sure I'm spelling correctly), journalist, who collaborates with Panos OA / Flamme d'Afrique.They will be all integrated in the IC comcom mailing list and some will participate to our online meetings, starting from next Wednesday when they will have their 2nd meeting.
[22:03:55] dan : ok
[22:06:06] Jason: In their first meeting they have discussed the following issues:
1. Internal/external communication
2. Contents
3. Means
4. Actors
5. Activities
6. Workplan
items discussed in this comcom
[22:11:05] Jason: I wont get into details here either - you will read their report.But I just want to mention a few things that were discussed:
- Languages, inclusion of several African ones (wolof, swahili, bambara, pouel...)
- How to distribute work among the people/organisations and at local and panafrican level.
- How to liase at the international level
- Website
- Dakar expanded and relationship with diaspora
- Shared communication projects (eg. between Panos, IPS, Ciranda, Amarc, etc.)
interest for Dakar expanded
[22:14:13] Jason: Questions, comments?I'm doing a monologue here... and could just write some notes...
[22:14:50] Pierre: (when i ask questionsthey arenot always answered:) )
[22:15:58] Pierre: some people volunteered /showed interestabout Dakar expandedat this stage , or is yeta remote idea ?if
[22:21:08] Jason: Answering Pierre: ?[22:16:22] Pierre: if yes they could be included in sfex group*
[22:16:31] dan : thanks Jason,it Jason[22:16:41] dan : it gives us a sense of the progress, progress[22:17:19] dan : I need a few minutes to solve a practical problem here in Sao Paulo
[22:17:57] Mallory : are we using the whiteboard?
[22:23:52] Jason: - There are a few web activists, besides Igor. The issue here is to bring together the webmasters of 3-4 sites, some of which are offline.The idea is to have a common server, reducing costs, maintenance and keeping the sites up after the events are over (but more of this next week?) [22:26:05] Mallory : yes next week [22:33:52] Jason: The event site can be based on the esf system... they are going to test it and get back to us about it -- also this should be discussed next week.
Webactivists – infrastructure and event website
[22:18:52] Pierre: also [22:18:52] Pierre: alos
[22:19:20] Jason: In the same meeting we had the report from the facilitator of the african culture commission. Here are some of the points mentioned: mentionned:
- how to have diversity and representation of artists, social cultural movements, etc.)
- how to share the values and principles of the WSF
- inclusion of popular expressions of culture
- cultural animation before and during the WSF2011
- involvement of youth and giving space for their forms of expression
- theatre, cinema, painting, etc...
- expositions and fair
- documentation
- gastronomy as cultural expression (yes, it is on of their issues - together with avoiding food from multinationals... maybe Nairobi lesson learned?)
- cultures from the diaspora
Media involvement [22:21:08] Jason: Answering Pierre: - Yes, there is interest in the Dakar expanded.It will also depend on the venue (I'll come to this shortly).Fatimata (facilitator of the diaspora group) and some others want to be included in the sfex group [22:23:52] Jason: - There are a few web activists, besides Igor. The issue here is to bring together the webmasters of 3-4 sites, some of which are offline.The idea is to have a common server, reducing costs, maintenance and keeping the sites up after the events are over (but more of this next week?) [22:26:05] Mallory : yes next week
[22:26:18] Jason: Finally, there was a whole discussion on media involvement, networking and "training" journalists of the WSF and its main thematic axes.Terna Gyuse from IPS South Africa was there and had a number of interesting suggestions.
African comcom on openfsm [22:26:37] Mallory : feedback from the draft email is pending then the call out will be made, hopefully forwarded to a large audience of people already working with the wsf/sf groups [22:29:48] dan : (accompanying) [22:30:50] Jason: Mallory, for me the draft was ok.I think we need to also write down what has been done so far (in terms of website developments, people already involved, etc.). [22:31:33] Jason: But before we get into that, let me just end my african report...
[22:32:52] Jason: There is an issue of how to collaborate together and besides inclusion in mailing lists(s), working groups and chats, the idea is that the african comcom documents its meetings in the space on openfsm.
Venue of Dakar [22:33:52] Jason: The event site can be based on the esf system... they are going to test it and get back to us about it -- also this should be discussed next week.
[22:36:32] Jason: The venue of the Dakar 2011 WSF could be:
- the university, very big with a whole new section with auditorium with videoconferencing setup, internet lab (6Mbit) with around 50 computers,and many classrooms but also spaces outside.It is near the sea.It would be perfect.But... it's only available from mid February (so no direct Davos connection)( [22:37:41] Jason:
- the expo/fair, farther off, huge hangar like structures with a characteristic architecture but not in good conditions (and asbestos on the roofs...) [22:38:49] Jason:
- the stadium, looks like Kisangani (in Naoriboi)... we didn't visit inside, but the outside was enough... [22:39:06] Jason:
I have some pictures. [22:39:21] dan : (when you're ready, I could report on developments in Johannesburg over the past few days) [22:39:22] Jason:
The dates have not been set yet.
[22:43:29] Mallory : and nice work jason, what a thorough report [22:43:42] dan : agreed! [22:43:55] Pierre: comcom is a good training ..... [22:42:42] Jason: C'est tout about that.
2010 visual identity
[22:42:42] Jason
Next week we should have the first proposals and the idea is that if this collective work... works, they could also help with the websites graphics.
Done.: [22:42:46] Jason: Done. [22:43:12] Jason:
[22:43:20] Mallory : yay! in regards to the logo
comcom plan finalization
[22:43:29] Mallory : and nice work jason, what a thorough report
[22:43:42] dan : agreed!
[22:44:57] dan : can I change the focus?
[22:45:04] Jason: Sure, go ahead
[22:45:26] dan : how did the final comcom submission go? [22:52:36] dan : anyone out there?
[22:53:44] Jason: The only comments / additions received were yours... and I did not see any objections.The only thing is that since it is a totally new activity, I think we need as a commission to discuss a bit about the details, and where how to integrate that work with the rest.
As for the final text, it still needs some polishing - but that is what will be translated by the WSF office and sent to the IC next week.So please, any suggestions on the text in general (intros, format) need to be done now. Next step is to detail each activity and schedule them (after a discussion on budget, which Salete and I have worked on yesterday).
[22:56:45] Pierre: so 2Oth is deadline for the montreal comcom report and also for sending suggestions on comcom plan ?
Next steps – activity
Next step is to detail each activity and schedule them (after a discussion on budget, which Salete and I have worked on yesterday).
[22:57:16] dan : ok [22:57:50] dan :
I'm looking forward to the discussion, discussion[22:58:14] dan : Salete too will understand the pedagogical dimension of the proposal
Comcom chat Agenda on line ?
[23:01:21] Jason: Yes.[I'm really need to go now, but I think we should make an agenda for the next meetings so we don't always improvise...]
Mallory what can we use for that - so we have a permanent agenda online (possibly not google calendar?)
[23:01:38] dan : ok
[23:01:41] Pierre: Yes : our chat agenda looks rather dense- 25thinternet focused meeting, dec 2nd budgetfocused? , dec 9th activty scheduling focused ?
[23:02:00] Mallory : goodness, no google calendar, please
Johannesburg news from Dan –info about African social forums
[22:39:21] dan : (when you're ready, I could report on developments in Johannesburg over the past few days)
[23:02:01] dan : I should also tell you that 12 countries from southern Africa are very interested in the WSF [23:02:14] dan :
they knew nothing about the WSF, but are all interested [23:02:25] dan : and also in the 'expanded' idea[23:02:34] Mallory : i'll send out the call for next meeting. please everyone forward the call to techies that you know that are working on wsf and local sf sites/tech [23:02:54] dan :
where they would develop forums in their country during the week of the WSF 2011 [23:02:54] Mallory : and in the call i will write the agenda on the whiteboard so that we can add to it and it will live as our notes. [23:03:25] Jason: [ooops - parallel chatting... one at a time, pls!] [23:03:45] dan :
I accelerated thinking you were about to leave....these leave....[23:04:11] dan : these communities/activists/NGOs have poor access to the internet [23:04:43] dan : unless they link to universities[23:05:38] Jason: [bye, go on - I will read tomorrow]
[23:05:46] Pierre: making a forum in a university is not a bad idea .... [23:06:02] dan : take care Jason, thanks for the report
[23:06:27] dan : I'll work on this once I arrive in Bogota [23:07:02] dan : at least this area now has a clear definition and actions
[23:08:57] Pierre: Dan, some forums have alreadytaken place in many countries in africa , but not big ones [23:09:13] Mallory : bye!
[23:09:20] dan : can you give me information about this?
[23:11:13] Pierre: Dan, can you give me the 12 countries you were talking about ? [23:11:35] dan : I'll get that for you, in the coming days [23:12:36] Pierre: (Dan will send you the input on participation/communication tomorrow) [22:26:37] Mallory : feedback from the draft email is pending then the call out will be made, hopefully forwarded to a large audience of people already working with the wsf/sf groups [22:29:48] dan : (accompanying) [22:30:50] Jason: Mallory, for me the draft was ok.I think we need to also write down what has been done so far (in terms of website developments, people already involved, etc.).
Jason and Pierre Feedback on Mallory draft message for tech meeting
[23:09:27] dan : Bye Mallory!
[23:09:33] Pierre: mallory before you go i have the same feedback as jasonindicate some link towhat has been done so far
(e-g http://openfsm.net/projects/wsfssc/project-home)
[23:11:13] Pierre: Dan, can you give me the 12 countries you were talking about ? [23:11:35] dan : I'll get that for you, in the coming days [23:12:36] Pierre: (Dan will send you the input on participation/communication tomorrow) ... then i guess our chat is over [23:12:47] dan : Ok [23:12:56] dan : Good to cross paths [23:13:08] dan : take care and good night [23:13:27] Pierre: (wave)