• transcript 30 august11

last modified September 5, 2011 by pierre

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Hellos. 1

Roberto. 2

Agenda discussion – Diyarbakir. 2

Agenda proposed for the meeting. 3

Diyarbakir –Amed. 4

Mallory in Palestine. 4

views on what to do in Amed ? canTwo people In a meeting make up for months of collective silence   5

Views on Paris meeting outcomes and report content. 5

 Farewell to mikael Looking for a sustainable frame in the evaluation group. 6

Agenda point 1 - When and who for next meeting about Amed dyarbakir. 6

Welcome Azril 8

Point 2 and 3 of agenda. 8

Point on technical needs – renewing server maintenance contract – discussing need for a full server-bbb instance   9

Invitation to azril 10







20:10:56] Jason: Hello whoever is online...

[20:11:03] Pierre: hello

[20:11:06] mallory: (wave)

 [20:11:50] Tidiane : I am here but I am sorry I have to leave in short time

[20:12:00] Jason: Hi Tidiane!  Mikael should be online too now.

[20:12:06] mallory: hi tidiane

[20:12:10] mikael: I am also here

[20:12:29] Tidiane : hi mallory

[20:22:50] norma: Hola, ya estoy

[20:22:54] mallory: hola norma!

[20:23:19] Jason: Hola Norma!

[20:23:33] Pierre: :)



[20:14:37] mikael: Is Roberto with us?

[20:16:27] Jason: I'm afraid not - he's in S.Salvador now and his internet connection isn't really good, but he just sent a message...

[20:17:22] mikael: yes, i read Roberto's msg. Glad he started saying smthg abt (against) military security

Agenda discussion – Diyarbakir


[20:18:40] Jason: So - shall we start proposing what to talk about and... how?  Last time it was suggested that we could have a voice call...

[20:19:32] mallory: as for the agenda, we definitely must discuss the forum and meeting diyarbakir. is norma here?

[20:20:20] mikael: Mallory, can you tell about Dyarbakir. I feel I know almost nothing.

[20:20:34] Pierre: as far as i know there is no agenda of the diyarbakir meeting released yet ..

[20:20:43] mallory: mikael, the meeting is an intercommission meeting followed by the mesopotamia social forum

[20:21:01] Pierre: well now the meeting is after the forum  26 adn 27th september

[20:21:06] mikael: well, and...Who is going there?

[20:22:30] mallory: right - good question. we will hopefully discuss this and other important details in the meeting

[20:22:44] mallory: are there other things? i believe dan sent something to discuss even though he can't attend

 [20:24:05] mallory: also, yo pienso que chat esta mejor

[20:25:37] mikael: acuerdo

[20:27:06] Tidiane : I have to move from office to home. I will catch you later.

[20:34:15] Jason: So... I would like to discuss many things (including what we do from now until the next IC meeting in Bangladesh), but I'll say that my priority now is getting some political issues sorted out (the "governance" and planning of this commission) and some technical matters (common server maint, websites, wsf portal).  No so exciting, but someone has to deal with them.

But of course we can start with the issue Norma and Mallory raised - the intercommission meeting in Diyarbakir.

[20:35:50] Jason: Disculpe Norma, necesitas traduction?

[20:37:17] norma: yo entendí que a Diyarbakir va Mallory, a mí me es imposible pues mandaron decir que no había posibilidad de apoyo para los pasajes .

[20:38:05] Pierre: Norma es bien possible que yo vaya tambien

[20:38:45] norma: No, jason, en términos generales entiendo bien, si me hace falta aclarar algo lo pido. Pero no escribiré en inglés, a lo mejor alguien necesite traducción

[20:39:16] norma: Me alegro, Pierre, cuantos más vayan mejor, y para ustedes es más cerca

[20:40:11] Pierre:  todavia no hay una agenda clara definida para la reunion

[20:40:34] Pierre: the event is 50-100 activity big

Agenda proposed for the meeting


[20:41:18] mikael: agenda proposal (summary)


1. The "governance" and planning of this commission


2. technical matters

- common server maint,

- websites,

- wsf portal


3. Dyarbakir

 - agenda clara definida para la reunion

[20:43:07] Jason: Thanks Mikael, but I would invert it, since we're already talking about the Mesopotamian SF / Intercommission meeting.

[20:43:21] mallory: (y)

[20:43:40] mikael: nema problema

[20:44:08] norma: Sí, s,upongo que deberíamos acordar qué van a plantear - o negociar - en Dyyarbakir, es pronto

Diyarbakir –Amed


[20:48:21] Pierre: there is no agenda yet .... so what we can imagine  is preparing some issues that will be discussed in dhaka in november

[20:50:26] Jason: I guess there is mainly what has been discussed with the methodology commission... (perhaps Pierre could update quickly).  I can give you an update on the resources commission - but I don't think it will meet there.

[20:51:15] Pierre: diyarbakir has not come into the radar of methodology commission but dhaka meeting has and the evaluation group is working on making a proposal about "evaluation as a process" also there is an interesting discussion about one of the recomendations from paris meeting " itnerchange spaces between event organizers"

[20:52:01] Jason: So who is going to this meeting after all?  It makes no sense if only a very small number of people meet.

[20:53:41] norma: Para mí es muy importante que vayan por los contactos con una zona que ha estado poco presente en el foro hasta ahora

[20:54:07] Pierre: si norma es una de las razones para ir this area has been visited by european social forum two years ago...their website is here :http://www.msf.web.tr/

but the case is that this meeting has been decided as a compensation instead of having the IC in dhaka ... so it is a bit bizarre  as far as i know there has never been an intercmmisison  meeting which was not linked to preparing a future wsf  (bamako , nairobi etc..)dakar in july ..so this is a first time !

[20:58:32] norma: Es cierto, Pierre, pero ése es un problema político interno del CI (lo de la compensación). A nosotros nos conviene relacionarnos con esa parte del mundo desde la comunicación

[20:59:11] Pierre: si esto es una agenda verdadera  (habra gente de tunes  irak iran turquia syria lebano  )*** Pierre added Erdal ***erdal estaba en paris y habla muy bien espagnol y ingles

Mallory in Palestine


[21:00:20] Jason: Mallory, you will be going with people from Palestine, right?

[21:00:31] mallory: it's not decided, some think that it is too late to organize something. others that we still have time and that it is important. but two maximum probably, a lot depends on this meeting, actually, since if i can go then i will help organize this we get very busy after eid in september

[21:05:54] mikael: eid?  (blush)

[21:06:49] mallory: the holiday

 [21:02:17] mikael: So Mallory is in Palestine?  I saw her interview with Richard Stallman and thought she might be.

 [21:02:44] mallory: thanks, mikael, yes.

views on what to do in Amed ? canTwo people In a meeting make up for months of collective silence


 [21:08:08] mallory: sorry, but maybe we should move the agenda forward more quickly... i think jason raised the issue with the importance of the meeting due to the size. and from there we should probably figure out two people, at least, to represent communications.

mallory: pierre, it would be great if you could go - for the continuity of the commission, i think

 [21:09:53] Pierre: well i might go ...for the several reasons evoked above .. although there is no clear agenda and we do not know who is going ... :)there is the intention to enlarge on internet some activities taking place there  so you may have an idea of what is going on

[21:15:54] mallory: i am in contact with erdal, but as is expected, only to clear up uncertainty. and i haven't seriously been organizing because of the uncertainty.

What [21:19:32] Jason: I think that it would be worthwile if we could have a proposal to bring there on 2-3 points (some of which already emerged during the Paris meeting) and give our support in preparing a real inter-commission meeting in Dhaka.  Probably it would be good if 2-3 people could go, but with the commitment of preparing and sharing/reporting back (and maybe, if possible, helping to extend that meeting there, which would allow maybe a few others to participate).

 [21:21:01] mallory: i support this fully. and i think discussion on those 2-3 points should happen in a separate meeting very soon

 [21:22:04] Pierre: i agree in principle and guess we cannot overexpect what can be done in the current context ... aslo with a dormant commission since may practicfally online operating capacity  of the commission is a main point . 2  people in a meeting cannot make up for  three months of silence

Views on Paris meeting outcomes and report content


[21:22:04] Pierre one outcome of paris meeting was an invitation for everyone in the commision to think about its working plan along a common document


[21:27:52] Jason: Yes, but there were some basic points agreed upon (a few come up to my mind, but we have a report we could look back to...:  concentrate on the Arab region (and I'd extend to the east, as Dhaka will hopefully bring some new energy in); work on keeping the movements' / wsf agenda visible; strenghten and improve the Social Forum Extended...

I agree with Mallory that we should dedicate a specific meeting for this...  (and that we have to absolutely improve our online meeting capabilities...

[21:29:27] mallory: yes, there was a good report from paris by jason and others. not complete, but good, i didn't mean to suggest that the report from paris deserves criticism from being incomplete, i was just agreeing with jason and pierre that it did not have enough inputs, i of course implicate myself in this

[21:38:08] Pierre: as far the report goes there are some points that we listed when we managed to concentrate on the review of the working document on the afternoon of our one day seminarhttp://openfsm.net/projects/communication-commission/comcom-meeting-parisdiscussionitems

 Farewell to mikael Looking for a sustainable frame in the evaluation group


[21:33:48] mikael: good luck, bye, have to go

[21:35:09] mallory: bye mikael

[21:39:13] Jason: bye mikael - I know it's not easy to follow a chat like this, but please keep it up... I think your contribution is really needed, especially when we're going to deal with the "live memory" of the WSF and connection with all the cultural / political / pedagogical aspects [if we'll ever get there...]

[21:40:43] Pierre: bye mikael , i hope there will sometime a sustainable  frame where to exchange on memory...  and on other issues

 [21:44:46] Pierre: i do think that the lack of such frame(s) is one of our main governance poblem in a processu such as wsf ... and evaluation process may helpmake something out of the rough feeling and recommendation from ic in paris ( where comcom people present  made inputs in the 4 groups ) is a challenge

[21:46:24] Pierre: http://openfsm.net/projects/ic-methodology/wsf11-evaluation-synthesis/#_Toc296642093

Agenda point 1 - When and who for next meeting about Amed dyarbakir


[21:47:25] Jason: So... can we decide on 2 issues we've discussed?:

- when to do the next meeting specifically on proposal for intercommission (elaborating post-paris and involving others)

- who is willing to go and commit to represent comcom in Diyarbakir

[21:48:12] mallory: i think that one week is almost too late for the meeting in preparation for diyarbakir. but maybe it's just right.: can we say same time, same day next week for the meeting?

[21:49:09] Pierre: fine with me

[21:50:34] norma: Sí, yo puedo

[21:51:40] mallory: good. nos puede abrir a todo en comms, por supuesto

[21:53:36] Jason: [Next Tuesday I will be in Barcelona - should be able to find a place to connect at that hour, but cannot guarantee]

[21:53:59] mallory: earlier or later better, jason?

[21:54:55] Jason: Probably better around 7pm, Mallory.

[21:55:45] whatever the day  it would be good to start exchanging  on the mailing list and acculmulate inputs untill next Tuesday

[21:55:52] norma: O sea una hora antes, Jason? Para mí está bien, no puedo más tarde

[21:56:10] mallory: pierre, good idea

[21:56:43] mallory: ok, norma and jason we keep the time the same. bueno?

[21:57:00] bazril: Para cuando (qué dia?)

[21:57:33] mallory: martes, en una semana

[21:58:27] Pierre: entonces 19h paris ? or 20?

[21:59:20] mallory: 19h, correcto?

[22:00:15] norma: Sí, 19 hs Paris, 14 hs Argentina. Hola Azril!

[22:02:57] mallory: ok, so on the people that can attend: pierre, norma, mallory. right? shall we just plan on this? and jason, we need to know frankly the possibility of financial support from comms.

[22:03:15] mallory: ^ we = norma, me, pierre (possibly?)

[22:04:10 | Edited 22:04:14] mallory: sorry, azril, we just need to finish this one point, i think

 [22:07:43] Jason:  Mallory - we should announce this meeting on the mailing list.  Maybe a voice chat could be better (we can try to all speak Spanish...?).  I can see what is possible about financial support for travel by then.

[22:08:10] mallory: yes, terrific



Welcome Azril


[21:54:08] *** Jason added bazril ***

[21:54:21] Jason: Azril just joined... hi!

[21:54:31] mallory: hi azril

 [21:55:04] bazril: Holaaa! Entiendo que es sin sonido, verdad?

[21:55:45] Pierre: hola azril !

[21:55:49] bazril: Hola Jason, Mallory, Pierre y Norma (sun)

 [22:03:11] bazril: Les haré un resumen del encuentro de activistas de hoy en Uppsala, que "sin ser" un foro social, tuvo la inspiración, el sentido y la dinámica del caso, centrado en el tema de la justicia climática. La iniciativa de hoy fue sugestiva en el sentido de activar el debate y la presión ciudadana y de los movimientos involucrados a nivel de los gobiernos municipales. Visualizarlo por un momento. Ya que los gobiernos nacionales en general reunidos en su club de la ONU no tienen la capacidad (ni la voluntad) de resolver los problemas que afligen al Medio Ambiente/Clima, a la Humanidad y a todos los seres vivos, porque no activar los "frentes municipales" como trincheras de lucha, incluyendo nuestras estrategias de comunicación en el plano local y planetario?

 [22:05:02] bazril: El próximo martes 6/9 estaré presentando mi poemario en el Instituto Cervantes de Estocolmo, sorry. Pero, igual, seguimos en contacto. Ya era hora, verdad? OK, Mallory. I cannot next tuesday - able other tuesdays.

Point 2 and 3 of agenda


[22:08:54] mallory: shall we hit point #2 and #3 of the agenda, in that order?

2. technical matters

3. The "governance" and planning of this commission

[22:09:58] Jason: I have 1/2 hour maximum left

[22:10:34] Pierre: i have 15mn left

[22:10:38] bazril: I could comment in writing the points #2 and #3 in the agenda as suggested by Mallory.

[22:10:40] mallory: maybe we just talk about the next point on technical needs save ourselves for another day in regards to comms governance :)

Point on technical needs – renewing server maintenance contract – discussing need for a full server-bbb instance


[22:13:52] Pierre: regarding technical needs we need to renew the maintenance contract for the server hosting several websites of comcom

[22:14:29] mallory: with whom is the contract? dimo?

[22:14:39] Pierre: yes with unweb.me

[22:16:09] mallory: we should without question, probably. or do you think there are things specific to this that need discussion?: also, is it possible to share the contract document? just for details' sake?

[22:22:22] Jason: I think we need to decide how we're using that server. Right now we're certainly under-using it.

We have 2 websites on it now (openfsm + worldsocialforum.info) plus a version of the conference software bigbluebutton. It could be used for the portal development, the mailing lists (though we just learned from the office staff that they have transferred them to another server mid-august, so we continue to duplicate costs), and I think we should also put any other website which isn't already covered by other means.

[22:23:11] mallory: the other possibility is that maybe we don't need a whole server, no?

[22:23:25] Pierre: i think having a smooth operation of this server is paramount for the evangelization of working groups which is one dimension of governance - we are overdue since march?

[22:24:01] Jason: "evangelization" ?!

[22:24:29] mallory: we can still evangalize if we downgrade to a shared hosting situation. is this option possible with unweb.me?

[22:24:29] Pierre: :) of couse we can discuss how many websites we put in ...isntalling  a instance of bigbluebutto could be an option

[22:24:49] bazril: Since I am less technically gifted than you, may proceed to leave this matter to you and say goodbye for the time being. Abrazos

[22:25:00] Pierre: i think the plone instance  needs a full sever

[22:25:09] mallory: jason reported that bbb is already on the server. i can confirm, since i have used it as a backup once or twice.

[22:25:17] mallory: bye azril

[22:25:25] Pierre: (be back)

[22:25:57] mallory: perhaps we can ask about the shared hosting. at least it will cut costs. and yes, this decision might hinge upon bbb needing its own server, i can't confirm either way because mfpl's bbb is also on a dedicated server, not shared, we could also just let wsf use the mfpl bbb instance (which is rarely rarely used by us and never used by other members)

[22:26:52] Pierre: (my 15mn are over ... )

[22:27:08] mallory: ok. thanks pierre should jason and i continue speaking on this, or shall we wait for you next time?

 [22:28:27] Pierre: i guess it would be good to get a statement of continuity then take time to discuss the details

[22:28:07] norma: Yo debo irme ya, nos encontramos la próxima

 [22:28:57] Jason: saludos Norma!

[22:29:12] mallory: adios norma!

[22:29:58] Pierre: ( i leave you for now)

[22:30:59] mallory: ok, bye pierre. jason, are we continuing?

[22:31:08] Jason: I am to keep it up as well as maintanance at least for other six months, but we have to make it worth it.

[22:31:43] Jason: Is it just us 2 left in the chat?

[22:31:49] mallory: yes if you want to go and IF you promise to talk to me online tomorrow, we can stop ;)

[22:32:47] Jason: ok - I promise.  I do have to go now.  My time is up.

[22:32:54] mallory: ok talk to you tomorrow, then i can send out the announcement of next week's meeting before i go

[22:33:27] Jason: Great. Thanks.

[22:34:05] mallory: (wave) bye

[22:34:56] bazril: adios a tods, second Pierre's suggestion concerning a statement of continuity...gracias y abrazos

[22:35:35] mallory: ( i was actually unclear about what he meant by statement of continuity )

Invitation to azril


[22:35:52] Jason:  Azril - maybe you should send a short proposal of discussion for the next comcom online meeting, so we can put it into the agenda.

[22:38:47] bazril: ok, Jason, shall oblige. It relates to what was hinted earlier: a local communication strategy defining the audience as the population within a municipal (local government) realm, which does not exclude other sorts of communicative actions at the national, regional and world levels...

[22:39:18] bazril: (wave)

[22:40:00] Jason: (wave)

[22:41:41] mallory: bye!