• tunis 201503 extension

last modified June 29 by facilitfsm


 20150328-tunis-fsm2015-310.JPG

videos & semi verbatim english notes of IC tunis 2015 held in UGTT headquarters 29 and 30th march

 

plan of video notes  ( made to give english translation to those following the meeting in live video) 

 

ci-mars-29-2eme-partie.jpg 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXEcdndpqxA&feature=youtu.be   3h08mn  29 march
second part from coffee break - including discussion on wsf2016   finalizing 3h05mn

 

ENGLISH TRANSLATION VERSION  ( reverse chronological order)


1 week agoglobalsquare made a new broadcast.

International Council Meeting World Social Forum, Tunis, 29-03-2015

decision about montréal wsf2016 at 2h50mn 

29 March 2015 14:33 CEST 

 ic-meeting-tunis-2015.jpg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4geFPmkN7I&feature=youtu.be  -  30 march morning 1h48 mn - about transition IC and working groups - next IC
    

 (note drafting in progress) 




29 mars

Hello everyone, there is a IC meeting today march 29th from 2pm in tunis inasmuch possible it will be streamed, check  in you tube  "esperanza efessem" https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCUGkY88973poKprpx3UsN5Q

we are on line, another channel   https://plus.google.com/events/c89t3vji4fujtpi1gquf24418ag

and another in English

[14:46:36]  starting

Mouhieddine: two days  of work ahead  of us, and conditions are not helping us

decision important to make during this IC we should have started at 2  and will go until 8pm tomorrow  9  to 1pm

i propose today to only give floor to IC members

define agenda

1/ political evaluation  - on regional context and stakes - Messaoud from FTDES 1h30 on this

2/ evaluation globale  WSF2015 1h30

3/ next  WSF where and who

4/ next IC where and who

5/ secretariat  (information) in tunis

6/ new entance in IC

 

Foreword by secretaire général UGTT –

I was asked two days ago  this 80 people  - excuse for material conditions press conference  tomorrow 10am hotel Africa

Discussion on agenda

Mimoun - agenda  needs decision

Damien asks for 20mn on memory and governance  instead of secretariat

Mimoun - why evaluation of context it is useless -

Mouhieddine -  ok for Damien 20mn

Vittorio  ok with Mimoun  discuss this forum and then the future

( Guștavo: this is good information - thanks for transcribing)

Raffaella -  compromise

Moema  - political evaluation is a need and habit

Hector there is no more place for an ideal agenda have main issues in the today agenda

Mouhieddine -  we have no way now to make a evaluation we have no elements for a deep  evaluation of sf 2015 since 2012, things occurred -  we are in a way of compromise give you some elements of balance

Taofik - will give some elements

 

Evaluation of wsf 2015

Piero - we have all impression  about the forum -  for me this formula is over we cannot go on

Taofik -  quickly estimated participation 45 a 50000 participants 5000 organizations registered 1200 activities 121 countries strong Maghreb presence African presence more than 2 years ago American presence  stable strong Palestinian presence

finance balance  -  820 000 euros  - less than past edition - leaning curve - better deals with national companies and governments, two months from here - audit and OC report will be sent

Mouhieddine  -  25  teleconference  -    science and democracy  free media  -  need to be on the table for future strategy

[ 15:23:37]  unplugging the loud speaking video1h06

Piero - there was 30 time more people in the government march  than ours this formula of forum is out of reality  - no one speaks about it - we have managed to make an assembly about ...  the region

Taofik -  this forum may not have taken place after 18th march was a shock in a stable country. the fact that the forum took place was a achievement - and there were people from the region speaking about what they wanted to speak

Palestinian issue - was considered central by OC - but Syrian Iraq and Libyan issue were also present

This forum was a central point in the life of social movements of the region

Kamal -  it was maybe impossible to hold the forum after those attacks  - the reaction of everyone was blunt - we hold it- we are under the risk of attacks and political assassination and  civil war in Libya  and government that do not agree on what we do and face agent from those stats that infiltrate our space- an issue is the gender equality

attack on Tunisia  - is against democracy  in globality not us - they wish to kill the unique  democratic experience - if it fails it is our defeat

we want to get inside the evaluation- i think we can be proud to have held this forum in such drastic conditions

[ 15:35:21Mimoun we are conscious of the conditions of this forum - we thank the organizing committee

2012  was a  positive evaluation  -  we expected a progress in 2015  - but the process is retro ceding

activities - we all agree there was good content -  was upset me is the organizing question -  no interpretation in activities

OC took decision to train a group  without consulting  Babels networks-

(uddhab : ok, good)

Delegation from Algeria and Morocco  - OC did not express concerns

1st march was disorganized - we walk like visiting Bardo

now the content of activities  - some of them was in contradiction with WSF charter: organizations that defend world bank - other social entrepreneur  -we have assume responsibilities  - there were integrists  -  a political party of morocco - - distribution of religious book by islamist group - which vision will we give  if we go on like this  - the end of WSF

Mouhieddine 3mn max

[ 15:43:46]  1h 26  Ouattara -   we gave a lesson to institutions - by going to Bardo - woman and youth were visible - satisfaction

Vittorio -   1 2  3/ strong disorganization  i believe that this history ended  - in 2001  - we said we must understand our enemy and each other ...now  we know each other  and history runs very fast   inequality grows - we need a forum which not only a public space fo debate   we need a space for militant fight, a place where to choose 1 2 3  campaigns- not useful to have hundreds of seminar - i can learn many thing on internet  -  this forum was useful for Tunisian people  -2/ useful for strong ngo

[ 15:51:01]  Gina -  dispersion  is a strong failure  -  lack of agglutination

we don’t have commission and working group - it is really time to see  ??- to see the amount of solidarity of people organizing themselves  3/ mixture men women nice

[ 15:55:24]  Leo -   be grateful to OC  - feeling that world  is close to the discussion forum is a big ship

( Azril  Bacal: Gracias por el video! :) )

and it is not be taking things out that we succeed  - it is by giving a spirit a quiet pause that we had in this form  take forward the assembly of convergence there is a lot to be done  - was a very good forum

[ 15:58:52]  Leonardo  cut  -  a meeting yesterday - we thank everyone  you are nice  thank you applause- activities changed place and time  -  have a central  board where all change be posted- sorry there was a failure of convergence of convergence

opening march  - disturbed by climate change  -  motto against terrorism was not in our values all types of oppression all types of terrorism

trade union could not have a meaningful presence 200 people from Brasil 100 organization

[ 16:02:52]  Gus - 1h45 evaluation is how through the contradiction we live we can move forward- issue is how we can adapt WSF to evolution of situation- which elements are to be taken into account for this

1/ we are obliged to change because situation changed in Tunisia

2012 revolution and  2015 pacific transition and generalized war - link social situation and war

in 2001 social movement were in expansion on their political space and now we are confronted with other movement than emancipation

What are the action that movement have to take at world scale - how we organize ot have a strategically debate  from movement view points

From organization - 3 elements played to make organization  difficult - we thank organization  comite -  was not helped by another element  meteo  rain and wind made discussion difficult and congeniality of forum was less

positive elements  - participation of movements was positive  - the frame - the movement came because they want to participate  - some who were afar came back   they wanted to discuss position of movements- forum stays a s convergence space for movement

Interesting debates  - an evolution of forum in the linking between WSF and thematic forum who allow to deepen issues and tackle mobilization

WSF as a space  is transversality  discussion between thematic

we saw hat difficulty was to go further on mobilization - those who worked were carried by thematic forum  -

ten great issues where it is possible to go further than simple discussion  - event if we were not able to organize restitutions

interested and contradiction space of transversality  

space of contribution between those who want to deepen  radicalize and those who want to enlarge

some come to learn  other want to go further

go further in this contribution and not eliminate one side of the contradiction

world issues are immense and we are not up to them  WSF stays as this space

[ 16:10:25]  Christophe  -  difficult of our discussion is that there are two ways  to watch this forum:

as event  - this forum  is successful

remember Brazil  Nairobi  Dakar    problem not different  from earlier, quality of debate and number of people  attended  an achievement

a second way is the political impact of the forum anther discussion contrary to Piero - 5 time more people in today - 10000

in those two continent we have major difficulty    in Europe and latin  America  forum process is stopped - political impact

Vittorio is wrong thinking that action direct event is good : we have tried  altersummit is not a success  -  then Florence  10+&0 was   -    low attraction of alterglobalism which is a real political program

[ 16:14:27]  Moema  -  i we have been more absent  - none of us have taken deep  commitment  - good points are yours - bad points are shared with us  : to all of us in IC it is time to say about the moment we are leaving in the workd

2001 was upraise of alterglobalist movement -it is easier to organize in transversality and open the door in such a context. today we are in resistance in all countries - it is dramatic in Brasil as well Bolivia  Ecuador Venezuela Mexico  facing a drama same in Europe

Used to have strong  movement - that his not our situation today

the forum has a strong vitality other we we would not have the house full

we have a deep responsibility  - how to move the rpocess forum i an moment fo dramatic attack of dark  forces of capital more organized then before

how to have a forum that help us to resist

2mn each

[ 16:16:41]  2h00 - Rafaella

strength of this forum is expressed by Kamal -  coming from all corner of the region: many people came here and improved their coalisation

global network  of disappeared migrant has been build t

coalisation for supporting Greece has established a work plan two plus

negative elements  coming from IC: lack of space for dialogue between networks (coming from the IC )

overcoming  fragmentation

real weakness

i do not think that forum can impose priorities  - it can help social actor to overcome fragmentation   tools to find their priorities

this WSF was possible thanks to passion  of Maghreb committee the IC did not do anything for this forum

[ 16:21:08]  roberto - unpopular intervention  -  old timer 2001 have a common view  about the forum -  organization structure is not directed to work but to dialogue: 30 organization  only out of 100 - two years without commission

After this meeting we do not take strategy decision  - this formula cannot allow us to elaborate strategies: ic is not a working tool

[ 16:25:03]  houtard -  problem of fragmentation   exchange - without convergence  -  facing the world crisis - civilisation crisis -   new paradigm of collective life of human being  on the planet

ic should precise what means another possible world how to define this ?

how to implement in common actions

we cannot change if we judgeand do not act -  get to united action as in alca in latin amercia

we need concerted results otherwise we loose hope

formula allowing not to change the basics  - but going towards a action

Relation with nature - economy -  use value- generalization of democratic process- interculturality

4 big issues make a step forward

[ 16:28:56]  mai sirock  -( to be reviewed with video) ??

what is the message form the form i have difficulty to say

remember in florence   - antiwar demonstration

we live a world with destabilization

i was in bardo - saudi arabia - we are against the consequences

george bush made a program war on terrorisms

who produce this terrorisms?

perhaps Tunis is the only country ..........i was in many forums - 5000   500 50

[ 16:32:54]  2h15

[ 16:33:12]  Piero - organizing committee is not the problem -  responsibility of IC

we were 2nd largest power after anti war demo in 2003

as event  it works   ... as Christophe says, we wiped away  SMA    assembly of assembly  e tc

kurds  have decided ....nobody knows what assemblies what is important now ?

we prepared seminar 6 months ago  everything  changed

is the place where to decide

[ 16:37:02]  PNGO thanks we would like to invite you all to support us

[ 16:39:30]  Annie  forum  is a process  not an event  we started in hammamet  a critical positive approach taking this process forward

the evaluation is essential we suffer from amnesia  all we proposed was held by the organizing committee

everything was held  am shocked about the way we direct  to C we ddid not do anything

it is the frist time we are proposed to agglutinate this is areal newness i thigna the organizers

forum has a certain maturity today  there are good and bad workshops

[16:44:45]  Amit -huge tribute  -  decision made quickly  to save WSF this is a discussion  htat we have after every forum it is a bit of a ritual . i remember threes of for IC meeting s we decide about detailed evaluation which we never do

i propose to have i 3 4 months why? obvious that WSF is in a period of transition -  methodology is changing where space is available fro movements  to come together why translation did not work  - why ? Methodology moving in the right direction but fewer movement using this methodology

the energy  in tunis was lower   in terms of numbers and quality of evaluation, while we are movement forward in making the space more friendly

Movements are using other spaces  -  you would expect that movement in a period of struggle would come to this space  -   special thanks to volunteers

[ 17:21:41]  now resuming  after pause  intervention from Choucha refugee camp

[ 17:27:54]  transform

[ 17:28:39]  tord -  at this world social  forum  - convergence took place as un people summit dismantling corporate power - convergence with climate justice

[ 17:30:54]  Damien  - this evaluation reflects problems we have in IC there is a certain imperialism from English and French the table has no gender balance and people less than 40 nobody speaks

[ 17:33:32]  pierre B - we started this forum 14 years ago long path in 14 years we have one cause  climate change like the 2003 anti war

[ 17:39:17]  Pierre G post event forum – on initiatives and documentation- meet in the evening

[ 17:39:33]  Prabir we did not show courage to have a second forum in india, WSF is a pace where to locale global resistance

WSF remains  a looks at the convergence  assemblies try to build convergence spaces from before how do we keep continuity

Overload of meeting and not enough action

( giuseppe: Thank you so much in tunis for doing this video!! Amazing work as every time! :))

 [ 17:41:34]  Francine  - not a criticizing to OC - accept responsibilities  -  stop discussing about same - interpretation is a crucial problem

we need another IC  two years - without anything  -  other structure - our strategy  between what is in the forum

[ 17:44:53]  Roger ( Canada)  -  1/ adopt analysis before Bardo event  - program great achievement  -   2/ hodling the forum  achievement- WSF was in a crisis - we had a tactical move  to tinisia  this cucle is ended- let us go to Greece

[ 17:46:17]  Taofik -   attempt of discussion  with babels was unsuccessful  - and late  difficulte  - resulted in non implication of babels

about interpretation - IC has great responsibility  - did not help political diagnostic  mobilization   resources raisin  - encouraging OC  no political initiative to enrich- some people helped individually  but IC was absent- all elements are on the table  -  gus Rafaella moema have made proposals to make WSF event more relevant in world transformation  -  a working group to give new ideas next session of IC

[ 17:50:23]  Messaoud -then  some intervention of flat movements

[ 17:58:00]  Mouhieddine we thank IC that entrusted WSF to us: in 2012 we had no experience, in 2015 we tried to move forward

we tired on many points to move forward  progress on agglutination  on program  on  villages

on 17th march  - aftre4 hours of hesitation  we decided o move on but organization changed completely

security  issues  - government is scared Tunisian have no habit of search  o body this has delayed people of tunis  did not want to go  because of the rain we engage  the people of university volunteers strike - less lodging- i came from France on march 17th we have defect and failure  -  translation

[ 18:12:21]  Moema  -  listing  the points in the agenda  53 - difficult points next WSF start

 [ 18:14:35]  Messaoud - the rhythm of the region is depending on WSF Tunisia  was triggered by social movement not political parties - weak because of dictatorship - led the islamist to power because they are organised -  laxity  -  extremism did not come wit revolution - 2  3  / void left by social movement  - we are still in the same process- terrorism has no frontiers  - they use internet twitter  develop synergies together in the region- Boko Haram  goes to Cameroon

Social movement  need a political strategy - leftist groups have no strategy

what the use of discussing thing if you do not develop proposal for the region

slogan of 2010   are WSF slogans  social justice is not found yet- this would restrict terrorism

[ 18:20:47]  youth  we need  dream  we need vision and dissensions than about us

[ 18:22:28]  x from ftdes- we wanted to show that movement is going on .. give breath to a country and  world movement for dignity

our movement is in crises we suffer- we hold WSF in tension of terrorism and civil war

4 devoiding factors  we started on a platform    on social justice    we move to religion   modernity   religion politic    2/  peaceful   > violence  assassination      3/  universal spirit  - all culture   cultural war - islamophobia and  hatred of other -all culture of wsf is threatened  - if this context goes on- junction of southern social movement and northern youth is the solution

[ 18:27:45]  Moema- maybe we can organize a dialog between observers and IC members but now we need to go forward. ask your support for us to improve on this agenda

 

[ 18:29:03]  1h08mn  next WSF

[ 18:34:10]  Moema  - proposing a commission  OC  2 members of IC  volunteers  tomorrow  first topic in our agenda   is it ok ? Damien and Vijay volunteering

[ 18:36:20]  Raphael- before presenting  WSF 2015  we thank  Tunisian  people and youth- concretize our aspiration  and dreams- social forum need to be built in this perspective of dream- we are a collective- we propose  Montreal  Quebec and Canada

Major opportunity  with elements for innovation to open participation

We do not consider social forum and movement be exhausted we see more and more gathering to occupy spaces

Our vision is here   spaces youth  occupy and speak out

Fundamental to bet on youth  -  exhaustion - we are staying behind not seated  waiting to be given the floor

We are children from WSF  -  i  have learned since 2004  -    concrete gathering  of youth- WSF needs this second breath  since 2010

50000 student on strike  - 140 organization  support our process  -  city of Montreal   3 university  3000 university logding -  strategies for visa  - solidarity  extension visibility  be as Inclusive as possible- we are ready we need green light

[ 18:42:21]  Carminda -  process    transparence  integrity dreams  youth- we want to put our part in the WSF process- give a room to all the people here today  evident we want to participate- rein vindicate the freedom of movement- visa - an upfront campaign

we have  a little team  ready to work with foreign affairs and lawyers- a lot of methodological innovation and importance of art

[ 18:44:50]  Genevieve (Aqoci)  -  we create platform of engagement   30 years- oxfam  - youth summit of oxfam inside WSF 2015

hope pedagogy  give space to youth to be heard  - youth do not want to be part of the problem  be part of the soilution

[ 18:46:06]  utala   autochthonous women idle no more- Canada  treads on humain rights of autochtonous people- i learn in WSF  about situation in the world- we are already mobilization

[ 18:48:12]  Carminda  - we made a song

[ 18:48:46]  Francine - we knew since last IC meeting that here is a real interest and mobilization, -in which measure has the discussion moved since Hammamet- our Greek friends have told us the are not ready  to organize a WSF  -not on the table

more than 10 Canadian organizations- need to have a protocol- recommendation of IC was to have a discussion in Canada

[ 18:53:39]  Hector- ask the other

[ 18:56:01]  Pierre B consultation  150 people- small consultations- 500 organization consultation- vast majority  happy

3 big social coalition   trade uniions women student- all of them support the idea- there are two dimitris and other

there is a huge critical mass that support  and work and makes sure  that everyone is included

[ 18:58:18]  Amélie -   resolution du conseil  general   67 members in all régions au Quebec- with partners in he world- we participated in various consultation meeting- adding that at the heart of our coceres we wish to tumble the development model- visibiilize struggle of southern country  in the north

[ 19:00:08]  Nathalie CSN acknowledge a building process  open legitimate- trade union  are not the main initiator- last FSQ was organized  by people  not linked  to trade union. reason for CSN not in the platform is not a priority for us  - but we have no veto on this initiative- if 100 groups are wiling   - if we are not backing up  - we communication  in a franck and open way- they know about it

if trade unions can have  solidarity  horizontal  towards other organization  it could be a breath for discussion here

[ 19:02:59]  Dimitri- represent Europe: every Monday  i dream of WSF in Montreal- every Tuesday  i ask is this relevant  strategically ? be strategies in political choice- in 1910 i want in Paris  we had prepared 1912  WSF in Montreal and we had active  support of the mayor

Arab spring   - Tunisian  told us  hold WSF in the Maghreb within 24h we withdrew our application

i wish Rafaela gives a report on the Greek wind assembly

choice has to be Greece in two years Brumas  i the room

[ 19:08:14]  FTQ -  we are in discussion  with Quebec collective -  a decision of IC will be backed by FTQ  U  we are not opposed to WSF in Quebec  -

[ 19:10:10]  Unifor are people who normally go to the forum   well get visa - answer those question   before- we have a right wing fascist government in Canada   election in October- if IC decides we will support

[ 19:12:51]  1h50  Piero -  we criticized the model not the OC- we need not  to discuss where to hold forum- propose to leave 1917 the forum IC make a proposal  what need to be change what is the role of IC- what can we do about Quebec proposal? forum international of youth in 1915- occupy  -  blockupy

 [ 19:19:08]  Leonardo    January 15  15 years commemoration- first forum in the north we do not know what will take place in Greece

[ 19:23:19]  Francisco : we are against  forum in the north  - 40 partners  in Tunis  - if we have no guarnatee we do not support

[ 19:24:15]  Gina -  they give fresh  air take greece out of the agenda porto alegre not so attractive

[ 19:28:06]  Jason -  favor

[ 19:28:48]  Leo  -  we arrived to the pont where we need to check obstacles  - a moment of uncertainty restructure around what ?

[ 19:30:58]  Chico - as a young -  am young  more time than you- seminaries on struggle nothing to do with WSF   can be held in Greece- porto alegre   can make something face to Davos  - seminar about proposal   profrss on IC- Quebec we have no right to stop this process  -they had patience  with us- we have no right to refuse

1915  and engage in a world campaign on visa in Canada

[ 19:34:42]  franck  - syndicat de la santé who support montreal 1915   - i came a as father i have two girls  -  i hop the youth wil continue  struggling  -  printemps erable  -  my daughter are demonstrating in Quebec am upset   there is repression

[ 19:36:35]  ouattara in 1910 i was in the room when  Canadian process started am convinced

[ 19:39:19]  Rafaella -  WSF every two year- add WSF 2°015 is too much pressure on social movement agenda- how to be useful to existing  social actors- to produce new dialogue with new social actors - am preparing this dialogue in Greece in Athens - if in Montreal  a big world social forum of youth  - it will be provide a good contribution

[ 19:43:49]  Taofik - skeptical on visa  -a forum where people from the south have problem to participate- short time to mobilize- what is their plan B ? link with south movement be substantial

[ 19:47:12]  Hector -  at the beginning of the meeting  we said  IC is useless WSF is useless and  we stay in the same  tends

[ 19:54:17]  Pierre G – can a forum in montreal in 1915 be counter productive? Why would it be?  – organizers have also pledged to make it an extended forum event

[ 19:54:24]  Mouhieddine: everywhere visa question is a check and balance position- commission evaluating progress- there is no other proposal

[ 19:55:38]  Maren cannot detach  theory from practice important to continue  wf process agree with amit   we talk because WSF process is going on

[ 19:58:52]  x ? Greece !!

[ 19:59:59]  Mimoun IC still operates - we take decision and come back on them we took a decision in Casablanca - as a event we can organize anywhere visa issue was set  in Casablanca- i expect Canadian friends to come with  info on visa

[ 20:02:51]  Gus  - our problem is to liberate energy to spare effort to make things better (- movements are ready   - give them the chance- as IC we have discussed o the way to evolve form to run  - 2015 2018  polycentric forums  everywhere  -   Alca in 2000 was important- we open  forum in Montreal    - open possibilities- it is not IC who made the WSF 2015 there are OC they dynamize IC- please ask them to give info about hardships

[ 20:06:14]  Teivo -  worst case  scenario ? WSF form on youth is paternalistic

[ 20:08:34]  Sonia -   check and balance ridiculous  - take social forum in the north- Trojan horse- visa  but bad room  for the south

[ 20:09:48]  Bernard - reason for success it the preliminary mobilization  process- and we have this same process i Quebec and Canada- occupy embassy’s and consulate world wide

[ 20:10:31]  sally- in the past we have always supported forum u the south- now global crisis  -   - build strong social movement in the north

[ 20:12:20]  Christophe  two more ideas -  we  know there is difficult of laing amercia and europe north America i vibrant with movement  -   we can benefit from this  - go in north America can help us- we can benefit from them- 2/ i hear Pierre B and Hector  we need  methodology  -  let us use Quebec to transform methodology of forum with them

[ 20:15:58]  Amit  as IC we do thing that question our legitimacy- reason of two year rhythm-  only funded international NGO being there- why revised  this principle- another reflection of how the IC works- we worked criteria  of what  - how inclusive process is .... we have not had this discussion- what harm would it make  -  it is not a price it is a responsibility- visa issue is a phenomenon only people  - you will have minimum  NGO participation from the south *

[ 20:19:45]  wilhelmina   -visa issue -

[ 20:20:19]   reseau dette et development- we have put water to mouth to Canadian friends- i expected them to present progress of their work - visa is a concern- we support 100%  holding in Canada- put effort on visa issue

[ 20:22:47]  transform- best way for  evolution is practice- there will be less African  - and more latinos

[ 20:24:04]  Annie - no vox- way to anchor a forum  - 80% local participation- anchoring is fundamental, building  takes time, i think as Brazilians and  gus  - the more there are events, the happier, not a youth forum

[ 20:26:52]  Massa (Burkina -novox  happy to see struggling youth  organizing the forum, we are not dreaming we cannot go

[ 20:28:01] (young participant)  je veux que les vieux aient confiance en nous i want them to trust us

[ 20:28:29]  Hamouda, we are in a key moment, movement  need to be in solidarity that is there is more forum is ok important to support Quebec, at the same time we are in an IC that is not operative- we had a structure that could  interact with Quebec there was not, we left  them alone -  we must support  - IC must find a new way of operation we need that our culture be included in forum strategy

we are in war   that will be a crap during the next five years

[ 20:31:18]  Moema Francine and myself  - listening  to all intervention major problem raised is the visa  question- our proposal is to really be together for visa- have a full WSF in  Montreal - brasil is proposing a thematic forum that is beautiful -   seminar in Greece part of the process quite ok as part of the process  deepens -  -  But now we say yes to Canada-knowing that there are many difficulties  problems butas well  there is a srong young mbilized open mouvement in canada and USA with support of all of su   there is a strong and oubh mobilized open movement  in Canada and usa- even with the support of those who cannot go to  for visa reasons - we will be together  - this is the proposal  -  applause

30mars

[30/03/2015 10:36:32]  resuming

agenda

Next thematical regional forum and international events

Memory  - restitution of achievement what we made here

Secretariat  and reorganization of IC 

New members

Next IC

 20150328-tunis-fsm2015-312.JPG20150328-tunis-fsm2015-313.JPG20150328-tunis-fsm2015-314.JPG 

intervention from volunteers

 – many have no place to stay -  - pyramidal structure of WSF  - volunteers are last on the list -  we cannot give  our opinions  - someone bosses us – and give our opinions -  

Taofik – les volontaires étaient autogérés processus de mobilisation de plusieurs mois – je ne vois pas ou est le problème

 

Next thematical regional forum and international events    

  ( see wsf2015-calendar)  page

Youssef Initiative from comrade in brazil  - propose international committee meeting in Palestine – Ramallah or Gaza  -  break the siege In Gaza – 

Forum for the youth in Palestine – when will see in the agenda

International social forum for youth in this region -  Italy Spain Greece in this region 

Chico Initiative propose au conseil de Hammamet – promouvoir un séminaire ( pas un forum) quelque part en 2015  autour de la stratégie des mouvements de la société civile face au pouvoir croissant du système qui provoque guerre  réchauffement – système est un pouvoir énorme et nous sommes en train d’etre mis hors jeu – pas suffisamment fort pour affronter le néolibéralisme -   pb de  stratégie générale – action de niveau planétaire  - une activité a eu lieu au fsm2015 la sale était pleine et la discussion était tellement bonne – on  a décide de continuer le lendemain  et 100 personnes sont venues

Le groupe d’institution qui  a proposé va continuer a  organiser les choses et vous invite a dire que vous veniez – l’année prochaine mars 2015   accueilli par les grecs 

Francisco Juin sommet G7 en Allemagne  on vous invite pour les activités  7 et 8  - congres alternatif jeudi manifestation 

Sally Internet governance use as experiment – accumulation of power threat on democracy -  from an anti neoliberal perspective  - looking  to all users of internet and social movements  - 85 organization have signed a call -  ad hoc coordinating  committee with 2 month delay

Vijay -  we do not pay enough attention to our guiding principles – motive can be to explode others -  guiding  principles say that all streams of  be included- Success of Hyderabad forum in 2003 is that non Marxist left was included – three person from brazil – visited – there is not happening in Nepal and in india  - old veterans  do not  appreciate   - there is a need that some senior from IC must visit  include Chico  - having dist  up  Bihar   and also two states of south india  all we culminate in a thematic forum -   see how WSF process has deepened – those  who have no fiuled  -    about 20 district forum before  2015

Leonardo  salimos a  10h30 a palestina – algunas organizaciones quieren proponer que  next IC  be in brasil

Gina Tarapoto foro panamazonico – 4 ejes  derechos indigen  hombre y mujeres  defensa ecosistema amazonio – integración con diversidad cultural Fecha no definida  2015

Salete Foro mundial de media libre -   POA 2015  or Montreal  2015

Hugo  IC meeting in athen in autumn ( withdrawn later)

Damien  Foro mondial de cultura de Resistencia ( when?)

Leo Assemblee – paix en syrie event in  Rojava   - conference pour paix et domcratie en syrie -  presence du conseil international

Jason  - ripess  observer hat  - septembre – ( is it inside WSF process ?)

Amit  -  organize a regional forum  on health and social security  march april 2015

Ali -  Iraq social forum October 2015

Arab – speaker – no concrete announcement of event

Taofik? - African forum  2015  ?

Raffaella -  send us lines ( vide

 

[10:38:37]  ​http://youtu.be/VI4RaH8Yfoc​  new channel for today

( uddhab l: Hi Pierre can you help read our proposal ?(was not read because did not fit well  in the various points of discussion but is left for reference)

Casablanca IC, the International Council "agreed to the proposal of the movements of Quebec to work in order to verify the possibility of having an event in the World Social Forum in Montreal in 2015. And it committed to discuss with the movements in Asia the opportunity to include an event in Asia in 2015 or in 2017. a proposal for  after Tunis 2015 will be finalized at the next meeting of the International Council."

I hope South Asian participants (who are more in number in the meeting than in Casablanca IC) will discuss about it, and explore the possibility to hold it in South AsiaIf our South Asian comrades propose and agree upon, we together with VK (South Asia), NIGD (South Asia) and Nepal Social Forum Secretariat will be happy to organize next IC with a Thematic WSF in Kathmandu in February-March 2015

Uddhab and Nepal Social Forum Secretariat

[10:43:12] this is for the discsusion on next IC which is at the end of todays discussion

[10:47:19] uddhab pyakurel: it is about a global event in Asia as well, IC n event, pls read whenever it is appropriate

if u read my ideas here: just to complement Vijay

 

Memory  - 

 (7mn video) Damien projet petrobrasi – group grap 2012  - some confusion with IC secretariat (ended 2012) -  work started start 2014   2000  digitized documents   out of 10000 -

[10:44:07] d space software  library software

 [10:45:20] norma (12mn )- hacer un lista de todos los foros  habidos e sus refernttes - send them a letter

[10:57:12]( video 26mn)  Leonardo -  brasil proposes to host  next IC  beginning of july  2015- left wing popular   celebration  2 july  in Bahia

] Grap proposed financing of memory  project to petrobrais- financing will end - end of july 2015- after that we will see

(14mn video)  janaina we came to find people to help take this project after it ends in july

Raffaella : Who is ready to join this working group – in addition to brazilian group ( 17mn video)

[11:02:43] Jason ( 19mn video) management of website  part of IC governance issue raised by Jason

Pierre (21mn video) propose to reactivate memodoc list created in Casablanca - agreed

(29mn video) Leonardo – Damien – it is Grap who got the financing of Petrobras I suggest people from ex Grap to answer

Chico – Petrobras helped only for  memory and ends in july 2015

(30mn video) Vijay systemic aavaz summer school- discussion on next IC will be later

Rafaella -  management of website

10mn break (31mn video)

[11:31:26] resuming  after pause difficulty to work

 

IC Secretariat

[11:31:59] send a proposal on secretariat task was supposed to talk in Hammamet - but no time we decided to have secreatariat in couple  - morroco and Tunisia  FTDES and FMAS will follow  -  stagiaire  Nils who is with us until june - supervision Hamouda and Alaa

[11:33:10] Hamouda -  we had trouble about world social forum website we have a webmaster that will work on site jason -  pierre interested

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4geFPmkN7I

 ( 0mn video ) Petite équipe de travail  premiere maquette – ancient webmaster brésilien avec janaina – pourvoir le lien entre site fsm et

[11:35:14] Mimoun - we had decided  in 2011  we decided rotating secretariat- the most correct  would be to move secretariat in Canada now

[11:36:34] Moema  - do not mix  secretariat of IC  with OC of WSF  - this IC secretariat  has many tasks in helping  IC to work better - folow the memory , to allow the working groups to really  have support  -  - organizing committee has many many  other task, if we mix the two  otherwise will be second priority- secretariat need to help IC to be effective in organizing the forum – welcome proposal by Hamouda – you have improved understanding of process -  FMAS  and FTDES have conditions  -while in Canada are starting and not members of IC

[11:38:18] liege - i have the same understanding as Mimoun  but i disagree with this  - i think  IC is different  discrimination sur es languages

[11:41:48] (8mn video)  OK with secretariat  - Vijay- china still not on board- in south asia Kathmandu is the place where to meet- a kind of supplementary secretariat is very necessary- bottom up process -  do have not support of party - those of us who have connection come here and give picture which  does not give the full picture- have a supplement secretariat in Katmandu -  financing  -  responding to reality of grassroots

[11:44:01] (video 10mn) Maren- I do think that the question of secretariat is important  - cannot be decided without a discussion on the genral functioning of WSF  - we need to take  time  - generous offer -  asap have an IC meeting that actually discuss functioning of IC  -

[11:45:51]  chico - do not complicate things too much  when they are already complicated- people ask I want to get in IC   to whom should i send a IC application? – I say send to heaven  may be it will land somewhere

transfer of secretariat was decided –Hamouda told  they received the IC secretariat knowing it was not OC , but   they could not handle it  -  tey were totally absorbed by organizing WSF- we are rethinking IC  - we need time to breathe- if Tunisian friends  are agreeing to take this role provisional for some time - so it can reexist   secretarial of IC – we thank and accept  -

[11:50:08]  Hamouda   - liege Chico Maren –we support  we were unable to handle the IC secretariat – we have sent a proposal for tasks – thre is a need to first rethink IC then specify secretariat  we give a hand and is not easy –and si not closed – we would like our friends in Asia an d brazil to help – that it will be collaborative  -  secretariat collaborative   Arabic  Spanish   we work together  -  I know that the Brazilian lave through – there is no money – we  make it without money -  waiting for IC to put in place a structure  volunteering

[11:50:33]  Rafaella  - be realistic  share what Chico said – Maren is right we have to reopen a discussion towards renewal of whole process  - also the tools of WSF process and IC  - this is a long discussion – for now  grateful for the commitment  - as volunteers withtou money -  we go home and we will see again  in the next IC  -  no sense to go on in this discussion

Go to net point of agenda –how to produce a good debate on

Can be agree on secretariat

[11:53:26] (19mn video)  ruby –support Vijay -  more role to forum  - Teivo – wonderful amount of forum – local forum should be more – participation  -increasing relevance  - strategy –not a technical proposal  - remaining organic  - have to be facilitated … secretariat concerted way to increase participation

[11:56:28](22mn video)  Pierre :  i share what was said on secretariat -   based on voluntarism and contribution -  create  group to include people willing to contributors  - in Casablanca we agreed on a list of 10 tasks of IC   - i will send again on IC list  -have the frame  and 

Can we Agree on that

[11:56:43]  gus – minimum level secretariat – janaina  endure secretariat  -  list et site

2nd thing site  there is nothing  -

3eme task Hamouda is doing alone since 5 years  - he takes initiative  date and agenda - convocation du conseil itnernatonal – easier when in the region

tache de liaison minimum entre préparation fsm2015 et conseil international

pour tout le reste il faut que nous discutions

minimum liaison tasks

fr the rest let us discuss

Wilhelmina -(26mn video)  we need to understand   decision made in the past  - other decision – political important that …

[12:01:20]  mimoun  - decision was Tunisia  - now we have two different countries  -  fmas  et ftdes   coordinated  par deux personnes deux pays different  - personally do not agree

Messaoud we close this discussion

[12:08:27] Rafaella – I ask if we can accept this proposal  - as a  temporary  arrangement until we have a more comprehensive proposal  on structuring of our work  - be realistic and committed personally how we reorganizes to discuss the IC- and reopen  discussion when ready for general discussion

Judith (31mn video) -  I feel the secretariat should be where the forum is

Raffaella -  the discussion on this point is over

Mimoun no consensus on this note this

34mn video

Take the floor only to suggest in which way we can make a good and effective discussion untill the next IC

 

How we reorganize until next IC  working groups about transitionic

Be realistic and committed  - started discussion many month ago- established working group – and majority of tasks – they vanished after conclusion of IC  - any kind of decision we take let us implement it – we can go until fourth millennium

How we reorganize to start the reorganization discussion on IC

[12:12:00] (37mn video) Moema – of course reorganization of IC is connected with reorganization of WSF - we stop the discussion on IC  because we are stopped in reorganizinge the forum

Work in transitions

we need a working group  that 2, 3 people to facilitate the work that will present in the next IC  working together with secretariat  a proposal about how we can work in the transitional time facilitated by 3 people

[12:12:15]   make an evaluation of  proposal on the table of people coming  in IC

 

[12:14:31] (40mn)  Jason -   we do not have commission any more  

one specific should address financial issues report back to IC – OC how finances have worked –

2/minimal minimal work  internet website social forum  this group can be  linked to the memory groupe – so we do not disperse

Executive mandate to this group

 

[12:15:00] (43mn) Agree with Moema – we need a little group of people committed  -  Francine: we cannot end before this seminar on strategy – I disagree with Chico – in this seminar we need to discus strategy of forum

3/ discussion politique to learn from each other what happens in the world

Hamouda (45mn video) - we have two  dates next IC I brazil  and Montreal

this working group must prepare a document, sent before IC, so we can react -  to have a discussion before july  and progress

no other issue on this next IC than reorganization of IC – so the secretariat can be put in place  -  2/ new membership 3 years pending 10 organizations -  a small group that review the documents and send on IC list and 72h to react- wen need this enlargement 

forum mondial au canada – next IC we can arrange

[12:24:20] (47mn) I understand we are on year transition – 15month  - three  memory group that take the tasks of a minimum web  - a group  support to secretariat -   reorganization of IC  -  clarify those three groups - four groups will be support for – making groups where people are not reacting is tiring

Chico  (51mn video) – 3 people that facilitate – the reorganization of IC  - axe de travail prochain ci only p, reorganization of IC other wise we do  not get out of it  -  there is also a IC before the next WSF

53mn video  Judith -  6 th o 10th july in Geneva  -

[12:31:58] (54mn)  Damien: next IC principal point  - agree with Chico  - reorganization is also governance  - secretariat – working group facilitating  - 4 years – 4 representative – I have not seen an organization going in or out  - IC is in crisis un recomposition process  -   ridiculous  to have new people in a IC in crisis – have a dialogue with them and think a new dynamics- we cannot decide today  - maybe july is too short and October better for next IC

[12:32:21](57mn)   Pierre 4 groups I will send on the list invitation and people will come on  the list

[12:32:48]  Gus –Damien so far nobody was excluded from IC   - and entry was refused 2 or 3 times  -  IC was always in crisies - secretariat  study the cases and submit on the IC list – people expresse their views

Hamouda  - not normal that we cannot answer them -  there are people willing to go in

Damien( 1h)  - we cannot think of new organization than entrance of  forums and coordination  - Canada forum is not in the IC 

Hamouda

 

[12:36:40]  Rafaella  - conclusion of discussion

 15 month transition We have many issue on which we agree

Transitional year - We can use all occasion to discuss - Past Greece to Quebec 1year and 3 month

Transitional IC  we decided that we will devote next IC mainly  to this discussion

we need in order to manage the next months  we confirm  or establish now 4 groups  -

those who raise their hand and be really committed to work

if you re not ready to work no problem

the task of group on IC reorganization to organize a big consultation  of everybody

in that case do not rise your hand yo will be consulted

4 groups

One on memory already done a and wti

The other one are person coming from regional experience to improve the work of transitional secretariat

Third group proposed by Jason

Last group animating the debate on the reform of the IC on reorganization produce a document with concrete proposals before next IC when we will decide

 

point on pending applications to be IC member

this part I really hope  that one of the first reform of IC  to open the door to the existing  social forum and convergence assemblies  - they are part of …organization are part of them

personally we will take in the next IC

my personal opinion  open the door to convergence assemblies and regional social forum –

what to do with those  organization which made the application in times when the IC was the old one  and which are waiting four years

[12:43:17]  Moema  propose that secretariat systematize  info  hey already have  - send to all IC  - we invite them as observers and allow  them to take part in the discussion –and next IC

Raffaella – until this last point ok for you  - transitional year  is ok  -  the 4 groups  finance memory  website – reorganization -  support of secretariat – we agree

1h11mn (global square person) Good to be more ambitious .. IC as open as possible   based on charter open -  social network competing facebook  video conference this would be  very important  people base - 

Rafaella – this is part of the content of the working group

1h13mn video  - força syndical brazil  - we participated  in many councils – we asked to be in IC  -

[12:48:50]  chico – all demands including this one  are sent by secretariat  to be sent in the list  72 h for  on the list  - IC – those yes  ok those no a rediscussed in next IC

1h15mn - Next IC  1h15 – transitional year – four working groups on finance  - one  on memory and website   one on transitional support   - one on reorganization of IC  - consultation   -  and to produce a document with concrete proposal before the next IC  - base of discussion in next IC

Discussion about opening of the IC  - but concerning the pending application proposal is to circulate-  are part of the discussion of opening  IC

(1h18mn )Damien – I have no veto right – not UN – CUT IPF agree  I recognize exceptional  contribution of organization  willing to get in IC -  we have another proposal – take the decision in next IC not in 72h  - if you want to impose your decision it is not a consensus – what your are proposing is not contribution to reorganization process

(global square)  [12:57:45]  judith -  directing to  global square  person  - it is the duty of those working group  to make sure they work  include people like you and that consultation includes your  contribution in the working group

Rafaella -  he is right -  it is a contradiction between us  - I agree we have only this remaining application  -  I receive this proposal frm the debate point of mediation  - pending  organization can be invited in the next IC as observers and then we decide in the

 [12:58:35]  Rafaella - in the next IC we decide ( compromise)

Salete – (1h24mn) some organization pending are observers a long time  -

Raffaella – they can be invited and in the next IC  we see

 

(1h27) Making working groups

Coordinate with Jason  - 

Support  secretariat contact ala or Hamouda

Reorganization  - who want to be part  raise hand– remains in the room after conclusion of meeting

 

[13:03:54]  next IC  

 One minute each (interpreters want to finish now ) We go without translation  thanking interpreters

Damien – we made the proposal* about Salvador de Bahia  - and july   can be discussed  by brazilian organization and reorganization group -  finance july is high season  if not july  September October    - brazil  -then july or bahia

(1h31) Piero – if there will be a proposal – will ask the Greek to have next IC in Greece in October- if we do not decide n ow we give this possibility unless the Greek rules out  -

Ppoulos  support piero - I want to support  Athens will be there  in Greece in ten days – as soon as possible

Messaoud  - he says he will see with the Greeks

Ouattara – si ils sont d’accord  after brasil

[13:10:07]  Annie - meeting late  3rd week of june  many movement meet in Athens  european social movements – a moment  to catch and send a delegation  - a team

(1h37mn) Rafaela  - point of clarification   greek wind assembly already discussed this  and goes round in circles -  disseminate plan f action to support Greece  -  the  if we want to explore in addition to seminar possibility of organizing an IC   -  have  a big solidarity event  october  November  -  now we need an IC after summer

Moema -  take both proposition brazil and Greece  and secretariat  together with Greece Brazilian and working groups -  secretariat  in consultation  defines and proposes in IC  - 

Francisco many events  September to December  take this in account

Messaoud  - We finish ! thank you very much  for being here  taking this challenge for Tunisia  -    long  for the WSF  - thank everybody – those young people who worked hard

1h43mn – Rafaella -  on behalf – we thank you for this long journey to democracy -  th the ey are standing  behing us since yesterday – the choucha refuges – in the desert  - without international convention  -  [13:17:05]  they are here remembering us this scandal

1h44 song dedicated to people  of choucha  - we are two we are three we are ……

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4geFPmkN7I

(1h 46mn)